3 ms·

No, I just don't think this manipulation is materially different than other forms, so I don't see it as particularly troubling. (Actually, I find it less troubl

by dilap 9y ago

No, I just don't think this manipulation is materially different than other forms, so I don't see it as particularly troubling. (Actually, I find it less troubling.) I am somewhat skeptical of democracy, though.

grzm 9y ago
> "I am somewhat skeptical of democracy, though." Would you elaborate on this? Alternatives you'd prefer?
- dilap 9y ago
  I have some ideas for alternatives or tweaks, but nothing I am particularly sure about. My general sense of skepticism comes from a few things: - The sense that America as a whole is somewhat shoddily run - The sense that San Francisco specifically is very shoddily run. - The (very elitist, I'll admit) feeling that I don't think the average person is competent to understand or decide most issues. To be sure, context matters: "who is your population", "what is your political culture" (tradition of bribery? of honesty?) &c are important; some very nice places seem to be working well as democracies. But I would not classify the city or the country I live in among them. Still unsure of & mulling over exactly what I'd do to fix things. (SF in particular is pretty bad: - Extremely rich - But staffed with a working-class that lives in poor conditions & is super overworked; basically, exploited - Filled with people living on the streets in conditions ranging from extremely bad to some of the extreme human misery I've ever witnessed - Decaying infrastructure - Constant low-level crime - Very (very!) dirty.)
  - supreme_sublime 9y ago
    Personally I think one of our biggest problems is universal voting rights. Only people who make a net contribution in taxes should be able to vote. Otherwise it becomes 2 wolves and a sheep voting on what's for dinner.
    - dilap 9y ago
      You have to be careful here though that you don't incentivize the creation of a powerless, exploited underclass.
      - supreme_sublime 9y ago
        Not really, if they aren't receiving any benefits from the government they are almost certainly paying some form of taxes with sales tax. Though since there isn't a federal sales tax it would probably make sense they wouldn't be able to vote federally. There is a chance of that happening, but it should be a self correcting system. If government assistance is pulled from people, they just opened a new voting block.

by dilap 9y ago

grzm 9y ago

> "I am somewhat skeptical of democracy, though." Would you elaborate on this? Alternatives you'd prefer?

dilap 9y ago
I have some ideas for alternatives or tweaks, but nothing I am particularly sure about. My general sense of skepticism comes from a few things: - The sense that America as a whole is somewhat shoddily run - The sense that San Francisco specifically is very shoddily run. - The (very elitist, I'll admit) feeling that I don't think the average person is competent to understand or decide most issues. To be sure, context matters: "who is your population", "what is your political culture" (tradition of bribery? of honesty?) &c are important; some very nice places seem to be working well as democracies. But I would not classify the city or the country I live in among them. Still unsure of & mulling over exactly what I'd do to fix things. (SF in particular is pretty bad: - Extremely rich - But staffed with a working-class that lives in poor conditions & is super overworked; basically, exploited - Filled with people living on the streets in conditions ranging from extremely bad to some of the extreme human misery I've ever witnessed - Decaying infrastructure - Constant low-level crime - Very (very!) dirty.)
- supreme_sublime 9y ago
  Personally I think one of our biggest problems is universal voting rights. Only people who make a net contribution in taxes should be able to vote. Otherwise it becomes 2 wolves and a sheep voting on what's for dinner.
  - dilap 9y ago
    You have to be careful here though that you don't incentivize the creation of a powerless, exploited underclass.
    - supreme_sublime 9y ago
      Not really, if they aren't receiving any benefits from the government they are almost certainly paying some form of taxes with sales tax. Though since there isn't a federal sales tax it would probably make sense they wouldn't be able to vote federally. There is a chance of that happening, but it should be a self correcting system. If government assistance is pulled from people, they just opened a new voting block.