6 ms·

This reminds me of the PHD in the office, who was hired because of some mathematical related skill they specialize in, is never getting their hands dirty. They

This reminds me of the PHD in the office, who was hired because of some mathematical related skill they specialize in, is never getting their hands dirty. They are off somewhere looking smart and protecting their allure, while us grunts are keeping the lights on. Broad stereotype here, but it is what I have experienced. To be very honest, being on Google searching constantly has been the most important skill. In this face paced IT environment, if you stay too long becoming an expert on something, it's replacement is coming right around the corner.... even within the same framework. As I was finally getting a hang off Spring 4 and Spring Boot 1.x, then comes Spring 5 and Spring Boot 2 with their new WebFlux architecture.

sidlls 9y ago
Maybe they're doing some analysis ("data science", statistics, etc.) that is important and you just aren't aware of it.
ggm 9y ago
A lot of the awesome I see people smarter than me doing, is not getting bogged down in nitty gritty but instead thinking about how to DTRT. Then, when they do it, the apparent effort is low: you've discounted the french metric tonne of thinking time that led up to it. Equally, they should get their hands a little dirty. Best is to be a great chef but spend some time with the bottle washers relating to being a dishpig. Nobody really likes Gordon Ramsay as much as the chefs who invest in staff development.
racer-v 9y ago
I think the massive amount of churn in the web world is the exception rather than the rule. If you learned C programming 40 years ago it would still be relevant today. Even Android is almost 10 years old now.
- prewett 9y ago
  If you learned Ada, Modula-2, Pascal, or BASIC, though, it might not be so relevant. COBOL, FORTRAN, Smalltalk, and Perl 5 are somewhat useful, akin to, maybe, jQuery in the web world.
  - racer-v 9y ago
    Point taken, but I feel all those languages had good runs. Modula-2 might have had less commercial success but still holds some intellectual interest. I sort of got sick of the web treadmill in 2013 as it felt like "learn a new toolkit every 18 months" and am primarily interested in something with longevity in that niche.
  - vgy7ujm 9y ago
    You can use Perl instead of PHP, Python or Ruby. They all have their strengths and weaknesses but overall they are very similar when it comes to usefulness. I prefer Perl.
  - jjm 9y ago
    JQuery is not a language. Like saying I “cuisine art” to a chef. Riiiiiight.
    - collyw 9y ago
      Sure, but jQuery from ten years ago is still jQuery. What iteration is Angular on now? Its doesn't have the churn that more recent web frameworks have.
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fwdpropaganda 9y ago
You're like the hospital janitor complaining that the doctor never wipes the floor. He's just off somewhere "looking smart". ... do you realise how ridiculous this sounds? Let me say that I get your point of view: I know of the existence of smart and educated people who are lazy, presumptious, have a superiority complex, talk down on everyone and/or are fakes. Do you understand my point of view though? Are you aware that people exist who are less educated people and who can't grasp that valuable complex things exist which requiring specialized knowledge, and that those less educated people being unaware of the existence of such things automatically and wrongly assume that their specialists are fakes?
- Jedi72 9y ago
  Since we're all throwing around anecdotes, I k ow both PhDs and long-time industry experts - gun to my head, one of them has to solve a problem or I die, I'm gonna choose the industry expert even if it's in the PhD guys field. Academic honours are very over-rated
- watwut 9y ago
  That is not nearly accurate analogy. Note that doctors in hospital do more then just looking smart. And know multiple people who are like he described: generally keep aura of looking smart are are good in few selected areas and generally don't really do much work. And they always get absurd amount of benefit of doubt the same way you do here. Meanwhile anyone who criticize them is assumed to be stupid hospital janitor who don't get that they are the ones who do real work. And know, they do not do "valuable complex things" nobody else cant grasps on the project. They talk about complex things around water cooler to impress people. And yes I do know people who do complex things too.
  - fwdpropaganda 9y ago
    Right, so we both know both types. But the person I was responding to either doesn't, or chose to omit one to try and make a point about it. > That is not nearly accurate analogy. Note that doctors in hospital do more then just looking smart. That's precesily my point. Doctors in hospital do more than just looking smart, even though janitors may or may not realise it. It's really an excellent analogy.
fsloth 9y ago
"In this face paced IT environment, if you stay too long becoming an expert on something, it's replacement is coming right around the corner..." Depends what the value adding function is. I work in a field (essentially CAD) where getting anything done takes years at best and if a technology does not have an estimated lifespan of at least a decade we don't invest in it. Web stuff is of course starting to spill in.
- jmartrican 9y ago
  Excellent point. Even though a lot of things change, there is a lot that remains the same or is done better with previous years of experience. CAD being a great example.
KKKKkkkk1 9y ago
This reminds me of the PHD in the office, who was hired because of some mathematical related skill they specialize in, is never getting their hands dirty. You know the adage "Work smart not hard"? That's what you get a PhD for.

sidlls 9y ago

Maybe they're doing some analysis ("data science", statistics, etc.) that is important and you just aren't aware of it.

ggm 9y ago

A lot of the awesome I see people smarter than me doing, is not getting bogged down in nitty gritty but instead thinking about how to DTRT. Then, when they do it, the apparent effort is low: you've discounted the french metric tonne of thinking time that led up to it. Equally, they should get their hands a little dirty. Best is to be a great chef but spend some time with the bottle washers relating to being a dishpig. Nobody really likes Gordon Ramsay as much as the chefs who invest in staff development.

racer-v 9y ago

I think the massive amount of churn in the web world is the exception rather than the rule. If you learned C programming 40 years ago it would still be relevant today. Even Android is almost 10 years old now.

prewett 9y ago
If you learned Ada, Modula-2, Pascal, or BASIC, though, it might not be so relevant. COBOL, FORTRAN, Smalltalk, and Perl 5 are somewhat useful, akin to, maybe, jQuery in the web world.
- racer-v 9y ago
  Point taken, but I feel all those languages had good runs. Modula-2 might have had less commercial success but still holds some intellectual interest. I sort of got sick of the web treadmill in 2013 as it felt like "learn a new toolkit every 18 months" and am primarily interested in something with longevity in that niche.
- vgy7ujm 9y ago
  You can use Perl instead of PHP, Python or Ruby. They all have their strengths and weaknesses but overall they are very similar when it comes to usefulness. I prefer Perl.
- jjm 9y ago
  JQuery is not a language. Like saying I “cuisine art” to a chef. Riiiiiight.
  - collyw 9y ago
    Sure, but jQuery from ten years ago is still jQuery. What iteration is Angular on now? Its doesn't have the churn that more recent web frameworks have.
deleted 9y ago
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fwdpropaganda 9y ago

You're like the hospital janitor complaining that the doctor never wipes the floor. He's just off somewhere "looking smart". ... do you realise how ridiculous this sounds? Let me say that I get your point of view: I know of the existence of smart and educated people who are lazy, presumptious, have a superiority complex, talk down on everyone and/or are fakes. Do you understand my point of view though? Are you aware that people exist who are less educated people and who can't grasp that valuable complex things exist which requiring specialized knowledge, and that those less educated people being unaware of the existence of such things automatically and wrongly assume that their specialists are fakes?

Jedi72 9y ago
Since we're all throwing around anecdotes, I k ow both PhDs and long-time industry experts - gun to my head, one of them has to solve a problem or I die, I'm gonna choose the industry expert even if it's in the PhD guys field. Academic honours are very over-rated
watwut 9y ago
That is not nearly accurate analogy. Note that doctors in hospital do more then just looking smart. And know multiple people who are like he described: generally keep aura of looking smart are are good in few selected areas and generally don't really do much work. And they always get absurd amount of benefit of doubt the same way you do here. Meanwhile anyone who criticize them is assumed to be stupid hospital janitor who don't get that they are the ones who do real work. And know, they do not do "valuable complex things" nobody else cant grasps on the project. They talk about complex things around water cooler to impress people. And yes I do know people who do complex things too.
- fwdpropaganda 9y ago
  Right, so we both know both types. But the person I was responding to either doesn't, or chose to omit one to try and make a point about it. > That is not nearly accurate analogy. Note that doctors in hospital do more then just looking smart. That's precesily my point. Doctors in hospital do more than just looking smart, even though janitors may or may not realise it. It's really an excellent analogy.

fsloth 9y ago

"In this face paced IT environment, if you stay too long becoming an expert on something, it's replacement is coming right around the corner..." Depends what the value adding function is. I work in a field (essentially CAD) where getting anything done takes years at best and if a technology does not have an estimated lifespan of at least a decade we don't invest in it. Web stuff is of course starting to spill in.

jmartrican 9y ago
Excellent point. Even though a lot of things change, there is a lot that remains the same or is done better with previous years of experience. CAD being a great example.

KKKKkkkk1 9y ago

This reminds me of the PHD in the office, who was hired because of some mathematical related skill they specialize in, is never getting their hands dirty. You know the adage "Work smart not hard"? That's what you get a PhD for.