4 ms·

Why is it that Asian people are earning 2x more than white people yet article is focusing on "white men"? Nice journalism. Not biased at all. https://i.imgur.

Why is it that Asian people are earning 2x more than white people yet article is focusing on "white men"? Nice journalism. Not biased at all. https://i.imgur.com/rjmHYk0.png https://i.imgur.com/rjmHYk0.png

neveroffensive 9y ago
> Why is it that Asian people are earning 2x more than white people yet article is focusing on "white men"? Because pay discrimination is actually skill discrimination, but we're all ideologues and have to ignore information to keep our fragile narratives intact. Edit: It's my understanding the wage gap has been thoroughly debunked. It's core premise relies on a univariate analysis of lifetime earnings that has no real analytical value. Although, in some instances, pay discrimination may still exist. It's isolated, and completely illegal.
justaman 9y ago
There has been a strong hate towards white men in particular in recent years. Everything seems to be their fault if you read huffpo.
- faitswulff 9y ago
  It's not actually a recent phenomenon...
- vkou 9y ago
  The problem is not white men, the problem is that our society has many (but not all) systemic biases that benefits them, at the expense of others. Many of these biases are so ingrained, they are invisible. As a white man, I don't have to deal with many categories of bullshit that people of color and women are subjected to. I do have to deal with a few things that they don't, but there aren't many of them.
  - hudon 9y ago
    This seems like a wildly sexist and racist sentiment. Do you have any evidence that being a white man causes you to have greater opportunities?
    - ghettoimp 9y ago
      Uh... yes? Are you seriously proposing that our society doesn't give white men more opportunities than minorities and women? Or that they don't have to deal with shit that white men don't have to? (If so I'd recommend the podcasts Reveal, Scene on Radio, Us and Them, and so forth.)
      - hudon 9y ago
        I'm asking for evidence that "being a white man causes you to have greater opportunities". If you can't provide that but you're only going to provide additional outrage, you're not really adding to the discussion.
        ghettoimp 9y ago
        Pretty sure I added more than whatever "outrage" you are inferring from my comment with my podcast suggestions. Here's a recent Reveal episode where they discuss how banks won't lend to black folks: https://www.revealnews.org/article/for-people-of-color-banks-are-shutting-the-door-to-homeownership/ https://www.revealnews.org/article/for-people-of-color-banks... Of course unequal lending and housing opportunities go back in time forever, with huge consequences for, e.g., the wealth that white vs. black families have been able to accumulate over time, since houses are most folks' biggest assets. Here's a recent Scene on Radio episode where they discuss the long history of federal programs that benefit whites and exclude blacks, etc. Of course you should really listen to the rest of the series for context: https://documentarystudies.duke.edu/podcasts/white-affirmative-action-seeing-white-part-13 https://documentarystudies.duke.edu/podcasts/white-affirmati... This is actually really interesting stuff to learn about, if you'd care to.
        hudon 9y ago
  - wu-ikkyu 9y ago
    As a man, you're more likely to be murdered, killed in a war, commit suicide, die in a workplace accident, and be sentenced to prison disproportionately longer for the same crime as compared to women.
    - vkou 9y ago
      I'm also incredibly less likely to be raped, be the victim of domestic abuse from my partner, pressured by my boss for sex, have my qualifications questioned over my gender, low-balled on offers, negatively evaluated for expressing 'masculine' traits in the workplace, be low-balled on hiring offers, have my career suffer because of fears that I'll have a child and take paternity leave, should I keep going..? The nature of privilege is that some people have more of it in certain contexts, and other people have more of it in other contexts. That doesn't mean that the playing field is equal. And, uh, if I were a black or native man, I'd have all the problems you listed, and a whole bunch more.
      - deleted 9y ago
        [deleted]
      - wu-ikkyu 9y ago
        Being killed or locked in prison (where the likelihood of rape skyrockets) seems objectively worse than any of those things, does it not? Why is it that you are so eager to ignore the inequalities against men in favor of women?
        vkou 9y ago
        It's great that we're talking about prison. If you're a black man, you are seven times more likely to be incarcerated then a white man. Five times more likely to be arrested for drug possession, despite similar rates of drug use. 30% more likely to be jailed before your trial. 150% more likely to be searched at a traffic stop. Since you're placing so much emphasis on prison, as worse then any of the things I listed, it sounds like you you should agree that white privilege is a huge problem. But let's take a step back. Since I'm a white man, my odds of being incarcerated are ~1/100. Small chance of that. If I were a woman, however, I'd be dealing with the problems I listed in my previous post all the time. Read my posts. Nowhere did I ignore that inequalities in both directions exist. What I take issue with is people blowing the inequalities that disadvantage white men out of proportion. Almost all the gender-particular problems they have, men of color have, with a second and third helping.
tatotato 9y ago
This is wrong. The article states Asian males earn 117% as much, which is just 17% more. This is one of the things that turns me off Hacker News, an overly strong bias in defense of white men.
- romanovcode 9y ago
  Yes, you are right. But even so - the point stands. I'm not trying to defend anything, especially white men. I'm just saying this journalism is biased to portray white men in bad light.
  - dragonwriter 9y ago
    How is the factually correct claim that white men, in the study, earn more than Black and Hispanic men, and more than women of any racial/ethnic category, painting them in a “bad light”? Would there equally true statement that Asian men earn more than men of any other racial/ethnic category and more than women of any ethnic category be painting Asian men in a “bad light”?
    - ovao 9y ago
      I think the issue stems from the author pointing out that white male wages as statistically disconcerting with respect to the racial pay gap without raising the issue of Asian male wages as being the same.
      - dragonwriter 9y ago
        There is no group referred to as specifically disconcerting. And both the relatively high pay of white males (in the body text) and Asian of both genders (in bold callouts on the graphics) are highlighted. White males are the comparison baseline, but Asians couldn't be used for that because they don't have data for the first decade+.
        ovao 9y ago
dragonwriter 9y ago
> Why is it that Asian people are earning 2x more than white people They aren't. 2× more is 300% of the base value. Asian men make 117% of what white men make, Asian women make 87% of what white men make (or 106% of what white women make.) So, Asian people earn between 6% and 17% more, not “2× more”, than what white people of the same gender make.
- romanovcode 9y ago
  As someone else pointed out - yes, you are right and I was wrong. However the point stands - Asians make more money then everyone yet article points out how white men are earning more. Again, I'm not trying to defend any white men or whatever, however don't you see the clear agenda this journalist is pushing?

neveroffensive 9y ago

> Why is it that Asian people are earning 2x more than white people yet article is focusing on "white men"? Because pay discrimination is actually skill discrimination, but we're all ideologues and have to ignore information to keep our fragile narratives intact. Edit: It's my understanding the wage gap has been thoroughly debunked. It's core premise relies on a univariate analysis of lifetime earnings that has no real analytical value. Although, in some instances, pay discrimination may still exist. It's isolated, and completely illegal.

justaman 9y ago

There has been a strong hate towards white men in particular in recent years. Everything seems to be their fault if you read huffpo.

faitswulff 9y ago
It's not actually a recent phenomenon...
vkou 9y ago
The problem is not white men, the problem is that our society has many (but not all) systemic biases that benefits them, at the expense of others. Many of these biases are so ingrained, they are invisible. As a white man, I don't have to deal with many categories of bullshit that people of color and women are subjected to. I do have to deal with a few things that they don't, but there aren't many of them.
- hudon 9y ago
  This seems like a wildly sexist and racist sentiment. Do you have any evidence that being a white man causes you to have greater opportunities?
  - ghettoimp 9y ago
    Uh... yes? Are you seriously proposing that our society doesn't give white men more opportunities than minorities and women? Or that they don't have to deal with shit that white men don't have to? (If so I'd recommend the podcasts Reveal, Scene on Radio, Us and Them, and so forth.)
    - hudon 9y ago
      I'm asking for evidence that "being a white man causes you to have greater opportunities". If you can't provide that but you're only going to provide additional outrage, you're not really adding to the discussion.
      - ghettoimp 9y ago
        Pretty sure I added more than whatever "outrage" you are inferring from my comment with my podcast suggestions. Here's a recent Reveal episode where they discuss how banks won't lend to black folks: https://www.revealnews.org/article/for-people-of-color-banks-are-shutting-the-door-to-homeownership/ https://www.revealnews.org/article/for-people-of-color-banks... Of course unequal lending and housing opportunities go back in time forever, with huge consequences for, e.g., the wealth that white vs. black families have been able to accumulate over time, since houses are most folks' biggest assets. Here's a recent Scene on Radio episode where they discuss the long history of federal programs that benefit whites and exclude blacks, etc. Of course you should really listen to the rest of the series for context: https://documentarystudies.duke.edu/podcasts/white-affirmative-action-seeing-white-part-13 https://documentarystudies.duke.edu/podcasts/white-affirmati... This is actually really interesting stuff to learn about, if you'd care to.
        hudon 9y ago
- wu-ikkyu 9y ago
  As a man, you're more likely to be murdered, killed in a war, commit suicide, die in a workplace accident, and be sentenced to prison disproportionately longer for the same crime as compared to women.
  - vkou 9y ago
    I'm also incredibly less likely to be raped, be the victim of domestic abuse from my partner, pressured by my boss for sex, have my qualifications questioned over my gender, low-balled on offers, negatively evaluated for expressing 'masculine' traits in the workplace, be low-balled on hiring offers, have my career suffer because of fears that I'll have a child and take paternity leave, should I keep going..? The nature of privilege is that some people have more of it in certain contexts, and other people have more of it in other contexts. That doesn't mean that the playing field is equal. And, uh, if I were a black or native man, I'd have all the problems you listed, and a whole bunch more.
    - deleted 9y ago
      [deleted]
    - wu-ikkyu 9y ago
      Being killed or locked in prison (where the likelihood of rape skyrockets) seems objectively worse than any of those things, does it not? Why is it that you are so eager to ignore the inequalities against men in favor of women?
      - vkou 9y ago
        It's great that we're talking about prison. If you're a black man, you are seven times more likely to be incarcerated then a white man. Five times more likely to be arrested for drug possession, despite similar rates of drug use. 30% more likely to be jailed before your trial. 150% more likely to be searched at a traffic stop. Since you're placing so much emphasis on prison, as worse then any of the things I listed, it sounds like you you should agree that white privilege is a huge problem. But let's take a step back. Since I'm a white man, my odds of being incarcerated are ~1/100. Small chance of that. If I were a woman, however, I'd be dealing with the problems I listed in my previous post all the time. Read my posts. Nowhere did I ignore that inequalities in both directions exist. What I take issue with is people blowing the inequalities that disadvantage white men out of proportion. Almost all the gender-particular problems they have, men of color have, with a second and third helping.

tatotato 9y ago

This is wrong. The article states Asian males earn 117% as much, which is just 17% more. This is one of the things that turns me off Hacker News, an overly strong bias in defense of white men.

romanovcode 9y ago
Yes, you are right. But even so - the point stands. I'm not trying to defend anything, especially white men. I'm just saying this journalism is biased to portray white men in bad light.
- dragonwriter 9y ago
  How is the factually correct claim that white men, in the study, earn more than Black and Hispanic men, and more than women of any racial/ethnic category, painting them in a “bad light”? Would there equally true statement that Asian men earn more than men of any other racial/ethnic category and more than women of any ethnic category be painting Asian men in a “bad light”?
  - ovao 9y ago
    I think the issue stems from the author pointing out that white male wages as statistically disconcerting with respect to the racial pay gap without raising the issue of Asian male wages as being the same.
    - dragonwriter 9y ago
      There is no group referred to as specifically disconcerting. And both the relatively high pay of white males (in the body text) and Asian of both genders (in bold callouts on the graphics) are highlighted. White males are the comparison baseline, but Asians couldn't be used for that because they don't have data for the first decade+.
      - ovao 9y ago

dragonwriter 9y ago

> Why is it that Asian people are earning 2x more than white people They aren't. 2× more is 300% of the base value. Asian men make 117% of what white men make, Asian women make 87% of what white men make (or 106% of what white women make.) So, Asian people earn between 6% and 17% more, not “2× more”, than what white people of the same gender make.

romanovcode 9y ago
As someone else pointed out - yes, you are right and I was wrong. However the point stands - Asians make more money then everyone yet article points out how white men are earning more. Again, I'm not trying to defend any white men or whatever, however don't you see the clear agenda this journalist is pushing?