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Wonderful example of Machine Learning being used to harm, the banality of evil: > Affiliates once had to guess what kind of person might fall for their unsophi
by 21 9y ago
Wonderful example of Machine Learning being used to harm, the banality of evil:
> Affiliates once had to guess what kind of person might fall for their unsophisticated cons, targeting ads by age, geography, or interests. Now Facebook does that work for them. The social network tracks who clicks on the ad and who buys the pills, then starts targeting others whom its algorithm thinks are likely to buy. Affiliates describe watching their ad campaigns lose money for a few days as Facebook gathers data through trial and error, then seeing the sales take off exponentially. “They go out and find the morons for me,”
- ThomPete 9y agoWhat in that is evil?
- WhompingWindows 9y agoYou wouldn't consider it evil to push bad products onto thousands of people with a technological tool, where before you could only push that product onto hundreds?
- ThomPete 9y agoSo it's evil because it's more successful? Not sure I understand the rationale here.
- marviel 9y agoIt's evil because it's a systematic way of hurting large groups of vulnerable people.
- thunfischbrot 9y agoTwo charts: x1: How much the product improves my life (judged based on how much I would be willing to buy it, asked after I acquired it) y1: How much the product costs x2: How much expendable income I have y2: How aware I am of how advertising influences my buying decisions Depending on where the marketed products/services and the targeted consumers land on these charts the answer to your questions may turn out very differently.
- double0jimb0 9y agoDo you have some example charts generated? Sounds interesting.
- cirgue 9y agoWhen you're successful on a large scale at doing something that is not in people's best interests, then yes I would consider that evil.
- Angostura 9y agoIt appears to me that the 'evilness' is being exhibited by the companies that decide to build crappy products. I don't see that Facebook algorithms designed to target people with similar profiles to those who have already clicked is inherently evil.
- throwaway2048 9y agothats where the "banal" part comes it, its a systematic, accepted practice that nobody questions.
- mbel 9y agoUsing AI to weed out people most susceptible to manipulation via ads doesn't really seem to be something that falls under "good & moral" category.
- ThomPete 9y agoBut this is what most advertising attempt to do so why is it evil just because they are better at it than others? No one is forced to use FB as far as I know.
- chrischen 9y agoDiet pills and male enhancement pills are generally scams. There is increasing pressure to use Facebook in order to fit in and be included in things. For example many people are contacting only through facebook and ignoring other channels. If I put a gun to your head and ask you nicely to take the pill or die, I'm essentially forcing you to take the pill as it's unreasonable for most to choose the die option.
- cuckcuckspruce 9y ago>There is increasing pressure to use Facebook in order to fit in and be included in things. >If I put a gun to your head and ask you nicely to take the pill or die, I'm essentially forcing you to take the pill One of these things is not at all like the other.
- chrischen 9y agoI'll elaborate a bit more on it. Let's look at the 70s, 80s, and possibly even the 90s. During these periods it was acceptable for most people to not know how to type, as usage of typewriters and keyboards were limited. But as society more and more adopted—and then relied on—computers and keyboard, it became increasing a necessity to be able to type. Back then you could get a job without typing skills, these days, it would be increasingly difficult to do so and you'd definitely be hampered by your inability to operate a computer. If you can't find a job, you'd be an outcast, and thus society has now developed a reliance on being able to type and use a keyboard (and thus a computer). As with Facebook, if society continues to rely on it for social engagements and developing connections with people, it will soon become a necessity to use facebook in order to participate socially or keep in touch with people. That's the trend at least. The difference with Facebook however is that it relegates a big part of society to a single company, and cedes control of social interaction to a black box of software and algorithms. So the slow progress of Facebook towards necessity is thus like the slow physical progression of my gun to your head: they're both making something become a necessity by limiting your options, whether it's taking a mysterious pill in my hand or becoming a social outcast.
- deevolution 9y agoIts taking advantage of the plebs.
- zouhair 9y agoThe people easily conned are the ones that think they can't be conned.
- mykull 9y agoAdvertising is the art of manipulating people into spending money. When they are made to spend in a way that is harmful to themselves or society, you could argue that it's evil, and I would. I'd go farther and say the economic system we have which elevates people to demigod status pretty arbitrarily and is ravaging the Earth is by extension evil. No one with any sense has control sufficient to stop us from spiraling into cataclysm or at least an unnecessary dystopia. Malicious advertisements don't have any right to exist, they just happen to be allowed because of our prevailing principles.
- mayniac 9y agoIt's scary once you start considering edge cases. What if the machine learning accidentally and unknowingly discovers that people with a certain mental illness are more prone to buying product X, then starts massively promoting product X to people on Facebook who also have the same mental illness because of shared traits? We should be careful with advertising to vulnerable people. This isn't even touching on the capability of nation states of nefarious groups manipulating populations on a large scale like Cambridge Analytica have likely done, which uses the exact same data advertisers use.
- pc86 9y agoAt what point do we classify buying magic weight loss wraps as mental illness in and of itself?