3 ms·

as a german i have to ask: like those remembering ww2 and the stasi? data tropes are a whole different deal, when power shifts to the ugly

Swinx43 9y ago
Exactly. It seems that everyone forgets that it is never a problem until unsavory people get into power. At that point it is too late. Unfortunately too few people building these systems seem to know history well enough to realise the apparatus they are building can also be taken over by entities they are today completely opposed to. We are still exactly the same species that have given birth to the Stasi and other oppressive forces. It would be good if people built their solutions with this in mind. Build defensively and with your users' privacy in mind from the start.
princeb 9y ago
that's an even older people problem. as a side note, the swiss banks did a massive job during WW2 hiding the identities of jewish customers who moved their wealth across the border. FATCA completely destroyed these secrecy laws.
- fuck_google 9y ago
  They were also hiding money robbed by the nazis and helping organized crime in money laundering.
mrtksn 9y ago
On online platforms, It's a stigma to compare current events with things that Nazis did because you'll be ridiculed if you do. According to the Godwin's law, the longer the conversation goes likelier it is that someone will mention Hitler. People know this, so it is very uncool to co-relate current events with Nazi Germany. You'll be called out even if you're talking about literal Nazis doing literal Nazi stuff. Memes are powerful, people don't like to be ridiculed. But it feels like this is wearing out. In Turkey, you can't show concern for privacy without being ridiculed because a very popular comedian made a joke about CIA targeting you personally while you're barbecuing. You'll be slapped with that joke the moment you mention about your personal data being collected. Jokes are powerful.
- simula67 9y ago
  Compare them to Communists
  - mrtksn 9y ago
    This won't work too because there's a joke about communist taking over the government this winter(It's a similar to the "Year of the Linux Desktop" joke). :)
- deleted 9y ago
  [deleted]
- rkachowski 9y ago
  I think one of the reasons that Germany (and to a related extent, the EU) has such strong and progressive laws regarding online privacy is due to having screwed it up so bad in recent history. The stasi situation is a very clear example of how ubiquitous surveillance can really fuck up social relations, and similar poignant examples are lacking from most western countries. Godwin's law and other comparisons are just figures of online speech, whilst here in Germany it's a very direct and concrete thing when there is clear and very recent (less than 40 years ago) history of these actions.

Swinx43 9y ago

Exactly. It seems that everyone forgets that it is never a problem until unsavory people get into power. At that point it is too late. Unfortunately too few people building these systems seem to know history well enough to realise the apparatus they are building can also be taken over by entities they are today completely opposed to. We are still exactly the same species that have given birth to the Stasi and other oppressive forces. It would be good if people built their solutions with this in mind. Build defensively and with your users' privacy in mind from the start.

princeb 9y ago

that's an even older people problem. as a side note, the swiss banks did a massive job during WW2 hiding the identities of jewish customers who moved their wealth across the border. FATCA completely destroyed these secrecy laws.

fuck_google 9y ago
They were also hiding money robbed by the nazis and helping organized crime in money laundering.

mrtksn 9y ago

On online platforms, It's a stigma to compare current events with things that Nazis did because you'll be ridiculed if you do. According to the Godwin's law, the longer the conversation goes likelier it is that someone will mention Hitler. People know this, so it is very uncool to co-relate current events with Nazi Germany. You'll be called out even if you're talking about literal Nazis doing literal Nazi stuff. Memes are powerful, people don't like to be ridiculed. But it feels like this is wearing out. In Turkey, you can't show concern for privacy without being ridiculed because a very popular comedian made a joke about CIA targeting you personally while you're barbecuing. You'll be slapped with that joke the moment you mention about your personal data being collected. Jokes are powerful.

simula67 9y ago
Compare them to Communists
- mrtksn 9y ago
  This won't work too because there's a joke about communist taking over the government this winter(It's a similar to the "Year of the Linux Desktop" joke). :)
deleted 9y ago
[deleted]
rkachowski 9y ago
I think one of the reasons that Germany (and to a related extent, the EU) has such strong and progressive laws regarding online privacy is due to having screwed it up so bad in recent history. The stasi situation is a very clear example of how ubiquitous surveillance can really fuck up social relations, and similar poignant examples are lacking from most western countries. Godwin's law and other comparisons are just figures of online speech, whilst here in Germany it's a very direct and concrete thing when there is clear and very recent (less than 40 years ago) history of these actions.