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Mass produced goods including furniture is cheaper nowadays but everything else is more expensive. This includes essential things like housing and healthcare.

Mass produced goods including furniture is cheaper nowadays but everything else is more expensive. This includes essential things like housing and healthcare. Further the needs have also grown: without a car it’s impossible for most people to have a job

vorpalhex 9y ago
> but everything else is more expensive Yes and no. One thing to keep in mind is inflation, so we always need to compare prices to average incomes. A house is listed as being <10k in 1940, but the average yearly salary was also <2k, and the minimum wage was $0.30 per hour. However, things have genuinely gotten more expensive in some cases usually due not to the economy, but due to safety. That's a good thing - we no longer have asbestos and lead paint, cars are safer, and working fire alarms are a thing. However, those things do cost money. You can no longer buy an all metal box that goes 80mph without seatbelts or airbags. I find the car claim to be somewhat of a red herring. Yes, you need a car now whereas before a bicycle might of sufficed. However, a decent car can be had for two thousand dollars - not a pretty one, but a functional one. You might be able to go cheaper if you have any mechanical ability, but we'll assume the average person doesn't have that. In addition now of course you need drivers insurance, and you probably need to take a drivers ed course before getting your license. Those things do add cost, but they also save lives.
- mcguire 9y ago
  Yes and no. The median home value in 1940, adjusted for inflation to 2000, was $30,600 ($2,938 pre-adjustment).[1] The median income for a man was $9,948, using the same inflation factor of 10.406639 ($956, unadjusted).[2] The median home sales price in 2015 was about $300,000[3] while median household income was $54,000.[4] [1] https://www.census.gov/hhes/www/housing/census/historic/values.html https://www.census.gov/hhes/www/housing/census/historic/valu... [2] https://www.npr.org/2012/04/02/149575704/the-1940-census-72-year-old-secrets-revealed https://www.npr.org/2012/04/02/149575704/the-1940-census-72-... [3] https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MSPUS https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MSPUS [4] https://www.census.gov/library/publications/2016/demo/p60-256.html https://www.census.gov/library/publications/2016/demo/p60-25...
  - refurb 9y ago
    You're ignoring that the percentage of people living in cities has gone up by 50% (56% -> 75%) from 1940 to 1990 (couldn't find later data). The size of homes has also gotten much bigger. So the $30,000 home in 1940 (in today's dollar) wouldn't look anything like a $300,000 home today. I'd be more interested to learn what a townhouse in Manhattan cost in 1940 and 2010.
    - jaclaz 9y ago
      And you need to count in something else, the actual changes in living standards. Nowadays the cost (for a new house) for "utilities" (water, electricity, heating, A/C, etc.) plants/hardware is a considerable factor, as a rough estimate 20-30% of the construction costs, and a large house in the 40's would probably have had one single bathroom/WC (if any[1]) for a 3 bedrooms home. jaclaz [1] In rural parts it was not so unusual to have an external loo
jameslevy 9y ago
Healthcare is a bit of an apples to oranges comparison from many decades ago. There are definitely serious problems with healthcare, but we are also increasingly getting options in healthcare that were not available 30, 40, 50 years ago and contribute significantly to costs. With housing, on the other hand, we are routinely seeing people pay upwards of 500% what people were paying for the exact same property a few decades ago with few or no changes, even with the effect of inflation removed.
maccard 9y ago
> Further the needs have also grown: without a car it’s impossible for most people to have a job In parts of the US. For most parts of the Europe, and indeed many cities in the US, a car is not a requirement.

vorpalhex 9y ago

> but everything else is more expensive Yes and no. One thing to keep in mind is inflation, so we always need to compare prices to average incomes. A house is listed as being <10k in 1940, but the average yearly salary was also <2k, and the minimum wage was $0.30 per hour. However, things have genuinely gotten more expensive in some cases usually due not to the economy, but due to safety. That's a good thing - we no longer have asbestos and lead paint, cars are safer, and working fire alarms are a thing. However, those things do cost money. You can no longer buy an all metal box that goes 80mph without seatbelts or airbags. I find the car claim to be somewhat of a red herring. Yes, you need a car now whereas before a bicycle might of sufficed. However, a decent car can be had for two thousand dollars - not a pretty one, but a functional one. You might be able to go cheaper if you have any mechanical ability, but we'll assume the average person doesn't have that. In addition now of course you need drivers insurance, and you probably need to take a drivers ed course before getting your license. Those things do add cost, but they also save lives.

mcguire 9y ago
Yes and no. The median home value in 1940, adjusted for inflation to 2000, was $30,600 ($2,938 pre-adjustment).[1] The median income for a man was $9,948, using the same inflation factor of 10.406639 ($956, unadjusted).[2] The median home sales price in 2015 was about $300,000[3] while median household income was $54,000.[4] [1] https://www.census.gov/hhes/www/housing/census/historic/values.html https://www.census.gov/hhes/www/housing/census/historic/valu... [2] https://www.npr.org/2012/04/02/149575704/the-1940-census-72-year-old-secrets-revealed https://www.npr.org/2012/04/02/149575704/the-1940-census-72-... [3] https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MSPUS https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MSPUS [4] https://www.census.gov/library/publications/2016/demo/p60-256.html https://www.census.gov/library/publications/2016/demo/p60-25...
- refurb 9y ago
  You're ignoring that the percentage of people living in cities has gone up by 50% (56% -> 75%) from 1940 to 1990 (couldn't find later data). The size of homes has also gotten much bigger. So the $30,000 home in 1940 (in today's dollar) wouldn't look anything like a $300,000 home today. I'd be more interested to learn what a townhouse in Manhattan cost in 1940 and 2010.
  - jaclaz 9y ago
    And you need to count in something else, the actual changes in living standards. Nowadays the cost (for a new house) for "utilities" (water, electricity, heating, A/C, etc.) plants/hardware is a considerable factor, as a rough estimate 20-30% of the construction costs, and a large house in the 40's would probably have had one single bathroom/WC (if any[1]) for a 3 bedrooms home. jaclaz [1] In rural parts it was not so unusual to have an external loo

jameslevy 9y ago

Healthcare is a bit of an apples to oranges comparison from many decades ago. There are definitely serious problems with healthcare, but we are also increasingly getting options in healthcare that were not available 30, 40, 50 years ago and contribute significantly to costs. With housing, on the other hand, we are routinely seeing people pay upwards of 500% what people were paying for the exact same property a few decades ago with few or no changes, even with the effect of inflation removed.

maccard 9y ago

> Further the needs have also grown: without a car it’s impossible for most people to have a job In parts of the US. For most parts of the Europe, and indeed many cities in the US, a car is not a requirement.