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My parents visited India a few years ago, they faced that issue when their guide refused to enter a coffee shop, when he explained that it was because he was no

• tacomonstrous 9y ago
  One of the main benefits in India of increasing urbanization is the accompanying anonymity. I would assume this incident didn't occur in a big city. Did it?
  • voltooid 9y ago
    People that do want to hate others, will find reasons to hate.
    • INvidiA 9y ago
      Is it really hate though? Or just people accepting certain social standards and living their lives in accordance. Sure it's soul crushing for those who are oppressed, but the oppressors would probably be well adjusted people in other societies.
      • voltooid 9y ago
        From personal experience, I know that the people that may be described as the oppressors in Indian "urban" societies are often the ones that take on servile qualities when they try to assimilate in Western societies. Western society is often seen as the superior kind and the so-called oppressors of Indian society recognize a hierarchy in it, in which they are at a lower rung. It is hard to break out of that mindset. Of course, this is all based on personal experience. I wouldn't say this is the general rule.
      • ams6110 9y ago
        It's called hate here, when for example a person regards homosexuality as immoral and opposes gay marriage. I've rarely heard anyone publicly claim that such people just have different social standards, or if they do, they are vilified for defending hate. Any time in history when one group has been oppressed by another, it's been considered normal by majority social standards of the time. When those standards change, discord and sometimes even war is the result.
        • INvidiA 9y ago
          But that's the issue. If someone simply sees homosexuality as a something that isn't "approved by God" or something of that nature, and they in their minds are just going along with God's law, are they really hating something? I've heard many anti-gay marriage people say that they have no problem with gay people but that they just oppose gay marriage. Is that cognitive dissonance? Almost certainly, but is it hate? I don't think so. We throw around the word "hate" too much and doing so loses a lot of the nuance bound up in human attitudes.
          • deleted 9y ago
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          • voltooid 9y ago
            Engaging in discriminatory, derogatory and demeaning behaviour actively. That comes from hate. The experiences of the person featured in the linked article, that could only come from hate. I think people that oppose gay marriage do so because of hate. But found a neat little loophole out of being called hateful by claiming that they have no problem with gay people. My reasoning is this: taking any kind of stance on any subject requires some kind of motivation. If you are moved to spend energy on something, you are motivated by some need to do so. If you oppose something that does not directly affect you, the reason is most probably hate.
            • Lambdanaut 9y ago
              As someone raised Southern Baptist but not currently identifying as so, I can attest that when I once peacefully opposed homosexuality, it was 100% out of a trust that God knew what he was doing and that I should trust him, despite my own personal ignorance. The belief that others can only oppose groups of people out of "hate" stems from a strong lack of empathy and understanding for people on the other side of the issue. > If you oppose something that does not directly affect you, the reason is most probably hate. Either that, or you are serving something percieved as greater than yourself.
      • jbros 9y ago
        This is a fundamental human algorithm that exists across all cultures and societies. This is exactly what hate is. And it should be pointed out by everyone. The oppressor only has power if others give it by being complicit.
    • tacomonstrous 9y ago
      My point had little to do with that. A city with millions of people and a large migrant population offer an opportunity to escape the communal memory that smaller populations can sustain. Unlike race, caste isn't an obviously visible feature, and even someone bent on discrimination will have a harder time discerning the relevant signifiers.
      • voltooid 9y ago
        People's last names often give away their caste, sometimes where they come from. I have seen people being treated poorly because of the way they dressed - that is the rich/poor divide. Also, a lot of Indians, even in cities, do still dress according to their religion or caste.
  • noobhacker 9y ago
    According to the author of the book being discussed, the caste system is very much alive in cities [1]. From what she said, it seems like people can tell your caste by asking a few simple questions or observing your body language. The caste system persists even among Indians in America. [1] https://medium.com/conversations-with-tyler/sujatha-gidla-ants-among-elephants-tyler-cowen-bd11b423ba91 https://medium.com/conversations-with-tyler/sujatha-gidla-an...
    • magic_beans 9y ago
      Thanks for posting this. Sujatha Gidla sounds like a really amazing, intelligent, and vibrant person.
    • tacomonstrous 9y ago
      Discrimination when it comes to housing (just as in matrimony) is still rampant in India: religion, gender, marriage status, and certainly caste are all reasons people are regularly denied access to rental properties. I suppose my point was more about ephemeral commercial activity, like entering a coffee shop, which was the example that was given in the grandparent comment. Edit: Fascinating interview, by the way. Thanks for posting it! Loved this part: >GIDLA: I will say this: Everybody is dying to know whether I got into university because of reservations. My answer to them is, “Go ahead and die.”
  • LarryL 9y ago
    I'm not 100% sure, but I believe that it was in a big city. At least, I'm sure it was not in a small town/village in the country.