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It makes a difference having a CEO that is so vocal about this, it changes what everyone in the org does and sees as "right". It's a good thing. At Facebook th

by kerng 9y ago

It makes a difference having a CEO that is so vocal about this, it changes what everyone in the org does and sees as "right". It's a good thing. At Facebook the understanding seems to be more Orwellian community like, spearheaded by Mark Zuckerberg. They envision and build a future where everyone is under surveillance at all times - so collecting a bit more doesn't matter, more to the contrary. Last week there was a story that FB internally also does surveillance on employees and they know what employee click and hover over on, and they monitor their messenger conversations. And it's all okay in their world view. Good to see some balancing conversations. I believe Apple took even a toll and fell a bit behind the last few years in regards to eg. Siri as they take personal data more of a liability rather than an asset. So, much respect from my side to Apple and Tim Cook for this. And I'm really not much of an Apple fan, but reconsidering with statements like this one.

jodrellblank 9y ago
the CLOUD Act (S. 2383 and H.R. 4943), a measure pushed by Apple and other tech industry giants but strongly opposed by privacy advocates. - https://appleinsider.com/articles/18/03/23/apple-supported-cloud-act-passes-congress-will-change-how-governments-share-data https://appleinsider.com/articles/18/03/23/apple-supported-c...
- yardie 9y ago
  They didn’t push it. They were just glad something was finally in writing. The alternative was letting the courts and companies battle it out. And all it takes is one bad precedent to fuck everyone. Laws are malleable, they can be massaged through the courts and have to be to be renewed. Precedents are much harder to fix and can only be overturned in a higher court. No one is happy about this, but they are relieved.
  - walterbell 9y ago
    Any examples of the types of cases/precedents they were trying to avoid?
    - my123 9y ago
      Microsoft v United States of America about access to data in Ireland for US authorities
      - walterbell 9y ago
        EFF has outlined several problems with the CLOUD act. Will US tech giants lobby for improvements? https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2018/02/cloud-act-dangerous-expansion-police-snooping-cross-border-data https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2018/02/cloud-act-dangerous-ex...
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deleted 9y ago
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woweeeee 9y ago
<IAmEveryone attr=“suck my dick”> operating devices owned by an employer is strike one. It’s not your personal property. You didn’t buy it from the store, you give it back when you quit or get fired, right? </IAmEveryone>
- IAmEveryone 9y ago
  > operating devices owned by an employer is strike one. It’s not your personal property. You didn’t buy it from the store, you give it back when you quit or get fired, right? By that logic, your landlord could install a camera in your bedroom. It’s their property after all, right?
  - deleted 9y ago
    [deleted]
  - nso95 9y ago
    You pay for your apartment, it’s reasonable to expect privacy.
    - ilovecars2 9y ago
      We also pay for Internet service, yet a lot of ISPs collect and extract browsing behaviour about their customers.
- deleted 9y ago
  [deleted]
- deleted 9y ago
  [deleted]
- kerng 9y ago
  BYOD and things like that are common at modern companies. Lines are blurry. You could say, oh when you join the device to the domain it's not yours anymore - still pretty odd. Even if they are legally okay, its unethical (especially when done covertly).
- 9y ago
cm2187 9y ago
Apple isn’t the privacy white knight either. By default every iPhone logs and sends to the mothership your gps locations. They designed iMessage in a way that ensured they could access the conversation. IOS comes with an advertising ID, etc. They are certainly not as bad as a Google or Facebook but they are not good either.
- willstrafach 9y ago
  > By default every iPhone logs and sends to the mothership your gps locations. > They designed iMessage in a way that ensured they could access the conversation Neither of these sound correct. Can you explain more or link a source on either?
  - cm2187 9y ago
    On locations: https://support.apple.com/en-gb/HT207056 https://support.apple.com/en-gb/HT207056 (it is enabled by default) On iMessage, the encryption keys are managed and accessible by Apple. Steve Gibson makes regular references in his podcast, like this episode: https://www.grc.com/sn/sn-574.htm https://www.grc.com/sn/sn-574.htm
    - tomduncalf 9y ago
      > enabled by default Actually, the device asks during setup whether you want to enable location services or not. They are also configurable per-app, obviously
      - cm2187 9y ago
        That’s to switch off all GPS. To disable the logging/upload to mothership, the settings is buried in Settings/Privacy/Location Services/System Services.
        wmeredith 9y ago
        Right. So location services are absolutely not enabled by default. You have to turn them on.

by kerng 9y ago

jodrellblank 9y ago

the CLOUD Act (S. 2383 and H.R. 4943), a measure pushed by Apple and other tech industry giants but strongly opposed by privacy advocates. - https://appleinsider.com/articles/18/03/23/apple-supported-cloud-act-passes-congress-will-change-how-governments-share-data https://appleinsider.com/articles/18/03/23/apple-supported-c...

yardie 9y ago
They didn’t push it. They were just glad something was finally in writing. The alternative was letting the courts and companies battle it out. And all it takes is one bad precedent to fuck everyone. Laws are malleable, they can be massaged through the courts and have to be to be renewed. Precedents are much harder to fix and can only be overturned in a higher court. No one is happy about this, but they are relieved.
- walterbell 9y ago
  Any examples of the types of cases/precedents they were trying to avoid?
  - my123 9y ago
    Microsoft v United States of America about access to data in Ireland for US authorities
    - walterbell 9y ago
      EFF has outlined several problems with the CLOUD act. Will US tech giants lobby for improvements? https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2018/02/cloud-act-dangerous-expansion-police-snooping-cross-border-data https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2018/02/cloud-act-dangerous-ex...

deleted 9y ago

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deleted 9y ago

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woweeeee 9y ago

<IAmEveryone attr=“suck my dick”> operating devices owned by an employer is strike one. It’s not your personal property. You didn’t buy it from the store, you give it back when you quit or get fired, right? </IAmEveryone>

IAmEveryone 9y ago
> operating devices owned by an employer is strike one. It’s not your personal property. You didn’t buy it from the store, you give it back when you quit or get fired, right? By that logic, your landlord could install a camera in your bedroom. It’s their property after all, right?
- deleted 9y ago
  [deleted]
- nso95 9y ago
  You pay for your apartment, it’s reasonable to expect privacy.
  - ilovecars2 9y ago
    We also pay for Internet service, yet a lot of ISPs collect and extract browsing behaviour about their customers.
deleted 9y ago
[deleted]
deleted 9y ago
[deleted]
kerng 9y ago
BYOD and things like that are common at modern companies. Lines are blurry. You could say, oh when you join the device to the domain it's not yours anymore - still pretty odd. Even if they are legally okay, its unethical (especially when done covertly).
9y ago

cm2187 9y ago

Apple isn’t the privacy white knight either. By default every iPhone logs and sends to the mothership your gps locations. They designed iMessage in a way that ensured they could access the conversation. IOS comes with an advertising ID, etc. They are certainly not as bad as a Google or Facebook but they are not good either.

willstrafach 9y ago
> By default every iPhone logs and sends to the mothership your gps locations. > They designed iMessage in a way that ensured they could access the conversation Neither of these sound correct. Can you explain more or link a source on either?
- cm2187 9y ago
  On locations: https://support.apple.com/en-gb/HT207056 https://support.apple.com/en-gb/HT207056 (it is enabled by default) On iMessage, the encryption keys are managed and accessible by Apple. Steve Gibson makes regular references in his podcast, like this episode: https://www.grc.com/sn/sn-574.htm https://www.grc.com/sn/sn-574.htm
  - tomduncalf 9y ago
    > enabled by default Actually, the device asks during setup whether you want to enable location services or not. They are also configurable per-app, obviously
    - cm2187 9y ago
      That’s to switch off all GPS. To disable the logging/upload to mothership, the settings is buried in Settings/Privacy/Location Services/System Services.
      - wmeredith 9y ago
        Right. So location services are absolutely not enabled by default. You have to turn them on.