3 ms·

I wrote that previous functioning civilizations purposefully restricted male sexuality, enabled utilizing energy that would be otherwise evaporated by sex into

by bitL 9y ago

I wrote that previous functioning civilizations purposefully restricted male sexuality, enabled utilizing energy that would be otherwise evaporated by sex into building society and its civilization structures instead. So that might be intent of some groups pushing these changes. Other groups might be pushing it for moral reasons, but those rarely had any tangible effects. Whether you like it or not, it is politically incorrect or going against the Zeitgeist, males still do most of the difficult, manual work that keeps the world running and is invisible to most women. There is a very little hope females would step up to the challenge as what we see so far is cherry picking high-income jobs isolated from crushing challenges of manual work and heavy robotics is not there yet. So if you tell those males they aren't desirable, they can't be entitled to have a partner, you allow them free access to cheap sex/sensory satisfaction, gaming etc. what you'll get is they just wouldn't care about work anymore, live minimalist lifestyles, working only to pay their immediate expenses, your society will be on a path to decline. By removing this "carrot" of a desirable woman, you neutered one of primary motivations of males to do anything at all. As they see 5% top guys getting all the girls and girls being fine with it during their desirable ages, and being interested in them only when their desirability wanes, and that only for financial reasons, why would they even bother being involved with society? So they simply drop out, do whatever they like, don't contribute to taxes, don't do any menial work, refuse to be slaves and disengage from society. I see it on my cousin, who was a top graduate of the most prestigious university of my country, and since graduation he is not working (a few years already), disgusted by women, and playing some stupid online games all day, without any way to poke him to do anything at all as it all seems pointless to him. So please keep closing your eyes, let's have another completely lost generation and see how our civilization tanks in front of our eyes. I would suggest you to study reinforcement learning, which even if using really stupid models, could show you how small changes in rewards can completely reshape environments, not mentioning complete removal of rewards, as is happening these days.

watwut 9y ago
Wtf are you about with worker class men? They are not ugly or something, plenty of them are attractive. That would be first thing. It is great that they have tons of jobs as you claim and if you are right, their salaries will go up which would be great. But economically, there is lack of those jobs currently. It is not worker class men fault obviously, it is economy. They play games because they don't have jobs. Not because they are too lazy without perspective of sex. I cant believe your opinion of men is so low. And if you see your existence as a slave, but with sex then it is ok to be slave? Men in history did a lot of things, good and bad, for their own purposes, not just in exchange for a sex. By all statistics, Americans spend more time in work then ever and men on average more then women. No being entitled to partner is not same as not being desirable. It primary means that world does not own you a partner and the potential partner has right to not be in relationship with you. You might be desirable to someone else. (And some guys are really too dangerous or sociopathic to be dated.) Your cousin is not working class men looking for hard labor job, his issue is not that women don't want working class men. University men don't do physically demanding work. But his parents should either find him counseling for depression or alternatively stop enabling his lifestyle (depending on what is cause of his passivity). By your definition should be among top percent - majority of population does not have degree. Besides, it sounds like you want girlfriend for him so that girlfriend partly becomes his mom to force him to work and partly uses sex to blackmail him into work. Wtf for both of them. Choosing mate for a girl purely on how much he earns and whether he is hard worker is receipt for disaster for her. It just does not even sound as if women were humans from your analysis, you treat them like a chocolate prize cake. You don't care at all about what she can achieve (and she is significantly less likely to spend all her time playing games), she is literally just piece of meat for him to have sex between wold of warcraft raids - in the hope that he will work afterwards.
- bitL 9y ago
  > she is literally just piece of meat Huh? Wow, I am speechless... Are you sure you wanted to type that? Imagine an artist with a muse. She occupies his mind, drives his creativity, unreachability of her perfection inspires hard work and progress, creating works of wonder. Now that artist finally gets intimate with his muse, faces the reality and brutal disappoinment with the illusion that was driving him, making him incapacitated for a while. So the carrot in the form of an ideal woman was responsible for some outstanding work that wouldn't happen otherwise; the moment the goal he hoped for was reached, the illusion was gone, and the well of artistic inspiration in the form of this muse was dry. Yet, something remained from this - a work of art, something the whole society benefits from. Try to apply this throughout the society to understand how great works were completed; this was one of a few main motivations (of course there were other ones for different works).
  - watwut 9y ago
    Yes, I wanted to type that. Women are not muses nor perfect, they are people and artist will be shocked that they fart, get angry, sweat and disagree with him. The artist made mistake when he lost contact with reality and replaced real human by unreal vision. This story has nothing with how women are like and everything with young man being lied to. I care less about his painting then about women who will become target of his wrath when he gets confronted with reality. And even he would be happier if he never went the illusion way. Plenty of productive men are not like the artist in that story.

by bitL 9y ago

watwut 9y ago

Wtf are you about with worker class men? They are not ugly or something, plenty of them are attractive. That would be first thing. It is great that they have tons of jobs as you claim and if you are right, their salaries will go up which would be great. But economically, there is lack of those jobs currently. It is not worker class men fault obviously, it is economy. They play games because they don't have jobs. Not because they are too lazy without perspective of sex. I cant believe your opinion of men is so low. And if you see your existence as a slave, but with sex then it is ok to be slave? Men in history did a lot of things, good and bad, for their own purposes, not just in exchange for a sex. By all statistics, Americans spend more time in work then ever and men on average more then women. No being entitled to partner is not same as not being desirable. It primary means that world does not own you a partner and the potential partner has right to not be in relationship with you. You might be desirable to someone else. (And some guys are really too dangerous or sociopathic to be dated.) Your cousin is not working class men looking for hard labor job, his issue is not that women don't want working class men. University men don't do physically demanding work. But his parents should either find him counseling for depression or alternatively stop enabling his lifestyle (depending on what is cause of his passivity). By your definition should be among top percent - majority of population does not have degree. Besides, it sounds like you want girlfriend for him so that girlfriend partly becomes his mom to force him to work and partly uses sex to blackmail him into work. Wtf for both of them. Choosing mate for a girl purely on how much he earns and whether he is hard worker is receipt for disaster for her. It just does not even sound as if women were humans from your analysis, you treat them like a chocolate prize cake. You don't care at all about what she can achieve (and she is significantly less likely to spend all her time playing games), she is literally just piece of meat for him to have sex between wold of warcraft raids - in the hope that he will work afterwards.

bitL 9y ago
> she is literally just piece of meat Huh? Wow, I am speechless... Are you sure you wanted to type that? Imagine an artist with a muse. She occupies his mind, drives his creativity, unreachability of her perfection inspires hard work and progress, creating works of wonder. Now that artist finally gets intimate with his muse, faces the reality and brutal disappoinment with the illusion that was driving him, making him incapacitated for a while. So the carrot in the form of an ideal woman was responsible for some outstanding work that wouldn't happen otherwise; the moment the goal he hoped for was reached, the illusion was gone, and the well of artistic inspiration in the form of this muse was dry. Yet, something remained from this - a work of art, something the whole society benefits from. Try to apply this throughout the society to understand how great works were completed; this was one of a few main motivations (of course there were other ones for different works).
- watwut 9y ago
  Yes, I wanted to type that. Women are not muses nor perfect, they are people and artist will be shocked that they fart, get angry, sweat and disagree with him. The artist made mistake when he lost contact with reality and replaced real human by unreal vision. This story has nothing with how women are like and everything with young man being lied to. I care less about his painting then about women who will become target of his wrath when he gets confronted with reality. And even he would be happier if he never went the illusion way. Plenty of productive men are not like the artist in that story.