3 ms·

Many unions don't demand dues from other people just to work in the same industry. A lot of people here (not you particularly; just that I might as well say it

Many unions don't demand dues from other people just to work in the same industry. A lot of people here (not you particularly; just that I might as well say it somewhere) have a very stereotyped view of what a union does, seeing it as some kind of compulsory enforcer that ties its members hands and goes around stopping outsiders working. I can't speak for everywhere, but my experience of unions in the UK is very different. Maybe this union could be modeled on that kind of approach. There's also the German Betriebsräte style which looks really interesting. For an industry full of people that spout about disruption and how things are different and what new technology can do to empower people, there seems to be this picture of "unions" stuck inside people's heads that involves Jimmy Hoffa sending some thugs round to smash up your workshop because you sold product without going through the union, and large mafioso "encouraging" workers to join. At risk of massively generalising, that picture seems strongest inside the heads of our US colleagues; is the anti-union propaganda particularly effective there, or are the unions particularly stuck in that stereotypical Jimmy Hoffa style?

DanBC 9y ago
To be fair the UK had to introduce law to stop "closed shop" unions. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Closed_shop#United_Kingdom https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Closed_shop#United_Kingdom > All forms of closed shops in the UK are illegal following the introduction of the Employment Act 1990. They were further curtailed under section 137(1)(a) of the Trade Union and Labour Relations (Consolidation) Act 1992 (c. 52)[7] passed by the Conservative government at the time. The Labour Party, then in opposition, had supported closed shops until December 1989, when it abandoned the policy in accordance with European legislation.[8] However, Labour shadow arts minister Thangam Debbonaire announced to an Equity conference in May 2016 that she favoured the introduction of a "limited" closed shop for actors, as part of Jeremy Corbyn's pledge to strengthen and introduce a new package of employment rights beneficial to employees.[9] Equity was one of the last trade unions in the United Kingdom to offer a pre-entry closed shop until the 1990 act.[9]
- EliRivers 9y ago
  Indeed; that's certainly how it was, but now we can have something better. That's the old way, which I certainly agree had to go, although even that didn't stop someone else working in the same industry. 1990 is well before my experience, but soon enough I expect to be telling people how I was there for the crash of September 2000, before they were born.
jpttsn 9y ago
I don’t know about propaganda but experiences are different in different nations. Is “many unions don’t” really a good argument? If some unions do, we could discuss whether the Game Workes union would, as go does.
- EliRivers 9y ago
  Okey dokey. To my knowledge, in my country, no unions do. It's beyond their remit. I suspect, but cannot prove, that today in the US a new union will not be able to make everyone stop writing game software. What do you think? Is that within their power?

DanBC 9y ago

To be fair the UK had to introduce law to stop "closed shop" unions. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Closed_shop#United_Kingdom https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Closed_shop#United_Kingdom > All forms of closed shops in the UK are illegal following the introduction of the Employment Act 1990. They were further curtailed under section 137(1)(a) of the Trade Union and Labour Relations (Consolidation) Act 1992 (c. 52)[7] passed by the Conservative government at the time. The Labour Party, then in opposition, had supported closed shops until December 1989, when it abandoned the policy in accordance with European legislation.[8] However, Labour shadow arts minister Thangam Debbonaire announced to an Equity conference in May 2016 that she favoured the introduction of a "limited" closed shop for actors, as part of Jeremy Corbyn's pledge to strengthen and introduce a new package of employment rights beneficial to employees.[9] Equity was one of the last trade unions in the United Kingdom to offer a pre-entry closed shop until the 1990 act.[9]

EliRivers 9y ago
Indeed; that's certainly how it was, but now we can have something better. That's the old way, which I certainly agree had to go, although even that didn't stop someone else working in the same industry. 1990 is well before my experience, but soon enough I expect to be telling people how I was there for the crash of September 2000, before they were born.

jpttsn 9y ago

I don’t know about propaganda but experiences are different in different nations. Is “many unions don’t” really a good argument? If some unions do, we could discuss whether the Game Workes union would, as go does.

EliRivers 9y ago
Okey dokey. To my knowledge, in my country, no unions do. It's beyond their remit. I suspect, but cannot prove, that today in the US a new union will not be able to make everyone stop writing game software. What do you think? Is that within their power?