6 ms·

Why would I want an extra gigabyte of memory usage for no benefit?

by na85 9y ago

jancsika 9y ago
Math.random() * 20 13.10651926269692 Ok, Thirteen it is. 1. Because clicking a link is quicker than `apt-get install krita` 2. Because clicking a link is quicker than: "E: Package 'krita' has no installation candidate" 3. Because clicking a link is quicker than `aptitude search krita`, seeing krita data files, but still no krita 4. Because I apparently have to open up a browser and type "Debian krita" to figure out how to install krita, so I might as well just run it in my browser 5. Because when it crashes in Chrome it's less likely to be a security risk 6. Because, unlike Linux distros, browsers have standardized on this system called a "link" to install new apps 7. Because I can run the program on someone else's machine without having administrator rights 8. Because I can run the program on someone else's machine without installing stuff to their user directory 9. Because I could probably even try it out on a kiosk where I have no rights at all (weak, I know) 10. Because, unlike Linux distros, browsers vendors as disparate as Mozilla and Microsoft were able to agree that clicking an "x" is the way to uninstall krita-in-the-browser 11. Because the web has at least two high-quality natural language search engines that I could use to discover this hypothetical krita-running-in-a-browser and they don't error out if I have typos 12. Because if I wanted to study how the GUI works I click a shortcut and an entire development environment inflates like a life raft on my machine, or someone else's machine, or any machine that runs a modern browser. 13. Because I could have spent this time using krita instead of writing thirteen fairly obvious reasons why clicking a link is preferable to screwing around in whichever Linux cult I happen to be stuck inside at the moment
- majewsky 9y ago
  So in your worldview, "Linux package manager" is literally the only alternative to web applications? I guess Windows and macOS don't have native apps at all then.
- fenwick67 9y ago
  Browsers don't have a stylus pressure API (nor any stylus API at all). No further discussion needed.
  - boudewijnrempt 9y ago
    Actually there is or was a WacomTabletPlugin for Firefox at least, but I have no idea about the state of that. In any case, as soon as Qt (with support for threading), eigen3, exiv2, fftw3, expat, fontconfig, freetype, gmic, gsl, iconv, ilmbase, libjpeg, lcms2, libraw, opencolorio, openexr, libpng, poppler, pyqt, python, sip, libtiff, vc and zlib can be built using one of the compile-to-javascript whatevers, we can take a look. I expect it'll be some time...
- jcelerier 9y ago
  > 1. Because clicking a link is quicker than `apt-get install krita` given the scope of the software, I fairly doubt so. Installing it and running it in less time than it takes for some web pages to load : sudo pacman -S krita --noconfirm 2,00s user 0,17s system 80% cpu 2,686 total the first working photo editing website I could find took 4 good seconds to load : https://sketch.io/sketchpad/ https://sketch.io/sketchpad/ and even then it's entirely broken because people making web UI cannot fathom why I would, as an user, be able to customize fonts of my system : https://imgur.com/a/kqZGT https://imgur.com/a/kqZGT
- egypturnash 9y ago
  So look I’m just gonna ask you one question. Do you do all your programming work inside a browser window?
  - sethrin 9y ago
    I did that for a while, actually. I was using cloud9 from a variety of (low-storage) netbooks. It did require a persistent network connection, but it was remarkably functional even on extremely tenuous wireless links. It was nice to have a dedicated workspace+vm for each project, without having to store everything locally, and the workspace was always exactly how you left it, even the running or half-typed terminal commands. I'm not sure I want to work that way by default, but it's quite practical, and potentially even preferable.
- na85 9y ago
  Sorry, none of those "reasons" are reasons at all in my book. I want native performance and native code, not a javascript bloat as a service.
- Ezhik 9y ago
  Web really will be the death of UX.
- fineline 9y ago
  One more: I could try out/ use the app on platforms for which it is currently unavailable, such as my iPad Pro (with large screen and stylus) or Samsung Note 8 (smaller screen but also a great stylus). Someone mentioned the lack of web API for stylus, which is a huge gap right now. I expect that gap will be filled sooner or later. Indeed with WebUSB it should be possible to implement drivers for the plug-in Wacom style devices for the web right now. Since getting these two great devices I haven't plugged in my Wacom once though. The lack of a really good vector app for Android (like Autodesk Graphic for iOS) is what made me curious to check out these comments and see what Krita is about. Yes the web has extra overheads, but it is the cross platform runtime with the broadest reach.

Why would I want an extra gigabyte of memory usage for no benefit?

by na85 9y ago

Why would I want an extra gigabyte of memory usage for no benefit?

Math.random() * 20 13.10651926269692 Ok, Thirteen it is. 1. Because clicking a link is quicker than `apt-get install krita` 2. Because clicking a link is quicker than: "E: Package 'krita' has no installation candidate" 3. Because clicking a link is quicker than `aptitude search krita`, seeing krita data files, but still no krita 4. Because I apparently have to open up a browser and type "Debian krita" to figure out how to install krita, so I might as well just run it in my browser 5. Because when it crashes in Chrome it's less likely to be a security risk 6. Because, unlike Linux distros, browsers have standardized on this system called a "link" to install new apps 7. Because I can run the program on someone else's machine without having administrator rights 8. Because I can run the program on someone else's machine without installing stuff to their user directory 9. Because I could probably even try it out on a kiosk where I have no rights at all (weak, I know) 10. Because, unlike Linux distros, browsers vendors as disparate as Mozilla and Microsoft were able to agree that clicking an "x" is the way to uninstall krita-in-the-browser 11. Because the web has at least two high-quality natural language search engines that I could use to discover this hypothetical krita-running-in-a-browser and they don't error out if I have typos 12. Because if I wanted to study how the GUI works I click a shortcut and an entire development environment inflates like a life raft on my machine, or someone else's machine, or any machine that runs a modern browser. 13. Because I could have spent this time using krita instead of writing thirteen fairly obvious reasons why clicking a link is preferable to screwing around in whichever Linux cult I happen to be stuck inside at the moment

majewsky 9y ago
So in your worldview, "Linux package manager" is literally the only alternative to web applications? I guess Windows and macOS don't have native apps at all then.
fenwick67 9y ago
Browsers don't have a stylus pressure API (nor any stylus API at all). No further discussion needed.
- boudewijnrempt 9y ago
  Actually there is or was a WacomTabletPlugin for Firefox at least, but I have no idea about the state of that. In any case, as soon as Qt (with support for threading), eigen3, exiv2, fftw3, expat, fontconfig, freetype, gmic, gsl, iconv, ilmbase, libjpeg, lcms2, libraw, opencolorio, openexr, libpng, poppler, pyqt, python, sip, libtiff, vc and zlib can be built using one of the compile-to-javascript whatevers, we can take a look. I expect it'll be some time...
jcelerier 9y ago
> 1. Because clicking a link is quicker than `apt-get install krita` given the scope of the software, I fairly doubt so. Installing it and running it in less time than it takes for some web pages to load : sudo pacman -S krita --noconfirm 2,00s user 0,17s system 80% cpu 2,686 total the first working photo editing website I could find took 4 good seconds to load : https://sketch.io/sketchpad/ https://sketch.io/sketchpad/ and even then it's entirely broken because people making web UI cannot fathom why I would, as an user, be able to customize fonts of my system : https://imgur.com/a/kqZGT https://imgur.com/a/kqZGT
egypturnash 9y ago
So look I’m just gonna ask you one question. Do you do all your programming work inside a browser window?
- sethrin 9y ago
  I did that for a while, actually. I was using cloud9 from a variety of (low-storage) netbooks. It did require a persistent network connection, but it was remarkably functional even on extremely tenuous wireless links. It was nice to have a dedicated workspace+vm for each project, without having to store everything locally, and the workspace was always exactly how you left it, even the running or half-typed terminal commands. I'm not sure I want to work that way by default, but it's quite practical, and potentially even preferable.
na85 9y ago
Sorry, none of those "reasons" are reasons at all in my book. I want native performance and native code, not a javascript bloat as a service.
Ezhik 9y ago
Web really will be the death of UX.
fineline 9y ago
One more: I could try out/ use the app on platforms for which it is currently unavailable, such as my iPad Pro (with large screen and stylus) or Samsung Note 8 (smaller screen but also a great stylus). Someone mentioned the lack of web API for stylus, which is a huge gap right now. I expect that gap will be filled sooner or later. Indeed with WebUSB it should be possible to implement drivers for the plug-in Wacom style devices for the web right now. Since getting these two great devices I haven't plugged in my Wacom once though. The lack of a really good vector app for Android (like Autodesk Graphic for iOS) is what made me curious to check out these comments and see what Krita is about. Yes the web has extra overheads, but it is the cross platform runtime with the broadest reach.