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Well, tax them on the money they make from EU sales then. I hardly see why the EU has a claim on revenues made by overseas companies on non-EU citizens. How abo

Well, tax them on the money they make from EU sales then. I hardly see why the EU has a claim on revenues made by overseas companies on non-EU citizens. How about the US levy a tax on global BMW and Benz revenues?

toomuchtodo 9y ago
> I hardly see why the EU has a claim on revenues made by overseas companies on non-EU citizens. For the same reason the US government has claim on all global income of both its citizens and corporations. [1] [2] Corporations brought this on themselves by using accounting cleverness to "hide" billions in profits [3]. This is simply a regulatory response. Tech companies can choose not to operate in the EU as well. This gets to the crux of the problem: taxing where the use takes place, not where the corporation is located. [1] https://www.irs.gov/businesses/income-from-abroad-is-taxable https://www.irs.gov/businesses/income-from-abroad-is-taxable [2] https://www.irs.gov/newsroom/people-with-foreign-income-or-foreign-assets-have-us-tax-obligations https://www.irs.gov/newsroom/people-with-foreign-income-or-f... [3] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Double_Irish_arrangement https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Double_Irish_arrangement
- cromwellian 9y ago
  >For the same reason the US government has claim on all global income of both its citizens and corporations. Keyword "IT'S CITIZENS AND CORPORATIONS". The US government doesn't have a claim on all global income of companies that aren't US corporations. e.g. Alibaba. I can't wait to see your reaction when the Chinese government asks for 3% of global revenues of Siemens.
  - toomuchtodo 9y ago
    Let's address that when Siemens is evading taxes like US tech companies are. I can understand employees of US based tech companies might have strong feelings about this stance. I'd encourage reflection on taxes and how they pay for societal infrastructure.
    - cromwellian 9y ago
      The Panama Papers revealed Siemens dodging taxes, that's why I chose that example. http://www.dw.com/en/paradise-papers-expose-tax-schemes-of-global-elite/a-41246087 http://www.dw.com/en/paradise-papers-expose-tax-schemes-of-g... If the EU wants to pay for social infrastructure, they need to tax money made within their borders and encourage the development of their own economy. I support Google, Facebook, Apple, and other companies paying taxes on the business they do in your borders, and harmonization of tax rates and laws across the Atlantic, but not some kind of unilateral "Marshall Plan" of taxation without representation. This kind of tax scheme is just going to lead to retaliation, just like tariff trade wars. Do you really think the US Congress and Administration will sit idly by and let the EU slap, in effect, a global 3% tariff on US corporations and not retaliate? I fear a real storm on the horizon with all of this growing nationalism. You've got right wing movements cropping up in the EU, you've got nationalism in the US, EU, and China growing. I don't think trying to claim extra-territorial extra-jurisdictional revenues is a legitimate tactic. And I'm pretty sure you've lose your mind if the CCCP imposed a 3% global tax on your local companies for money they made that was unrelated to exports to China.
      - toomuchtodo 9y ago
        > I don't think trying to claim extra-territorial extra-jurisdictional revenues is a legitimate tactic. Taxing revenues derived from users in your own country is not extra-territorial taxation. > I fear a real storm on the horizon with all of this growing nationalism. You've got right wing movements cropping up in the EU, you've got nationalism in the US, EU, and China growing. As a nationalist in the US (which does not make me right wing, merely empathetic to my fellow citizens first), I fully support the EUs efforts to enforce taxation on foreign tech companies who have been taking extraordinary efforts to evade taxation.
        cromwellian 9y ago
        > Taxing revenues derived from users in your own country is not extra-territorial taxation. They are taxing on revenues that Google/Facebook/Twitter make on US citizens, advertising to US users, from US sales offices. That's extraterritorial taxation. If they merely taxed % of global revenues made on EU citizens, I wouldn't object. Let's say you estimate a company makes $10 per yearly active user per year, so if you have 300 million active EU citizens, and you made $3 billion in revenues, then apply 3% tax to that. But that's not what this proposal does. Perhaps you need to read it.
cryptoz 9y ago
> How about the US levy a tax on global BMW and Benz revenues? As long as those companies are pumping out gasoline cars that pollute the air and the environment around the US, that sounds like a great idea! Those companies are unfairly creating pollutants and encouraging their customers to raise the global temperature, dirty American's air, and everyone else's, etc. I would be pleased to see the US pose taxes on businesses that are actively harming Americans.
Dwolb 9y ago
This is akin to a franchaise tax. I'm pretty sure the thinking of the legislators is taxing net income is too easily manipulated. Therefore by taxing a 'small' (up for debate) amount of revenues there's less gamesmanship that can take place when determining tax liability. For reference, Texas charges a 1% tax on taxable margin over $1M with three options for determining taxable margin. This gives companies less wiggle room when determining tax liability

toomuchtodo 9y ago

> I hardly see why the EU has a claim on revenues made by overseas companies on non-EU citizens. For the same reason the US government has claim on all global income of both its citizens and corporations. [1] [2] Corporations brought this on themselves by using accounting cleverness to "hide" billions in profits [3]. This is simply a regulatory response. Tech companies can choose not to operate in the EU as well. This gets to the crux of the problem: taxing where the use takes place, not where the corporation is located. [1] https://www.irs.gov/businesses/income-from-abroad-is-taxable https://www.irs.gov/businesses/income-from-abroad-is-taxable [2] https://www.irs.gov/newsroom/people-with-foreign-income-or-foreign-assets-have-us-tax-obligations https://www.irs.gov/newsroom/people-with-foreign-income-or-f... [3] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Double_Irish_arrangement https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Double_Irish_arrangement

cromwellian 9y ago
>For the same reason the US government has claim on all global income of both its citizens and corporations. Keyword "IT'S CITIZENS AND CORPORATIONS". The US government doesn't have a claim on all global income of companies that aren't US corporations. e.g. Alibaba. I can't wait to see your reaction when the Chinese government asks for 3% of global revenues of Siemens.
- toomuchtodo 9y ago
  Let's address that when Siemens is evading taxes like US tech companies are. I can understand employees of US based tech companies might have strong feelings about this stance. I'd encourage reflection on taxes and how they pay for societal infrastructure.
  - cromwellian 9y ago
    The Panama Papers revealed Siemens dodging taxes, that's why I chose that example. http://www.dw.com/en/paradise-papers-expose-tax-schemes-of-global-elite/a-41246087 http://www.dw.com/en/paradise-papers-expose-tax-schemes-of-g... If the EU wants to pay for social infrastructure, they need to tax money made within their borders and encourage the development of their own economy. I support Google, Facebook, Apple, and other companies paying taxes on the business they do in your borders, and harmonization of tax rates and laws across the Atlantic, but not some kind of unilateral "Marshall Plan" of taxation without representation. This kind of tax scheme is just going to lead to retaliation, just like tariff trade wars. Do you really think the US Congress and Administration will sit idly by and let the EU slap, in effect, a global 3% tariff on US corporations and not retaliate? I fear a real storm on the horizon with all of this growing nationalism. You've got right wing movements cropping up in the EU, you've got nationalism in the US, EU, and China growing. I don't think trying to claim extra-territorial extra-jurisdictional revenues is a legitimate tactic. And I'm pretty sure you've lose your mind if the CCCP imposed a 3% global tax on your local companies for money they made that was unrelated to exports to China.
    - toomuchtodo 9y ago
      > I don't think trying to claim extra-territorial extra-jurisdictional revenues is a legitimate tactic. Taxing revenues derived from users in your own country is not extra-territorial taxation. > I fear a real storm on the horizon with all of this growing nationalism. You've got right wing movements cropping up in the EU, you've got nationalism in the US, EU, and China growing. As a nationalist in the US (which does not make me right wing, merely empathetic to my fellow citizens first), I fully support the EUs efforts to enforce taxation on foreign tech companies who have been taking extraordinary efforts to evade taxation.
      - cromwellian 9y ago
        > Taxing revenues derived from users in your own country is not extra-territorial taxation. They are taxing on revenues that Google/Facebook/Twitter make on US citizens, advertising to US users, from US sales offices. That's extraterritorial taxation. If they merely taxed % of global revenues made on EU citizens, I wouldn't object. Let's say you estimate a company makes $10 per yearly active user per year, so if you have 300 million active EU citizens, and you made $3 billion in revenues, then apply 3% tax to that. But that's not what this proposal does. Perhaps you need to read it.

cryptoz 9y ago

> How about the US levy a tax on global BMW and Benz revenues? As long as those companies are pumping out gasoline cars that pollute the air and the environment around the US, that sounds like a great idea! Those companies are unfairly creating pollutants and encouraging their customers to raise the global temperature, dirty American's air, and everyone else's, etc. I would be pleased to see the US pose taxes on businesses that are actively harming Americans.

Dwolb 9y ago

This is akin to a franchaise tax. I'm pretty sure the thinking of the legislators is taxing net income is too easily manipulated. Therefore by taxing a 'small' (up for debate) amount of revenues there's less gamesmanship that can take place when determining tax liability. For reference, Texas charges a 1% tax on taxable margin over $1M with three options for determining taxable margin. This gives companies less wiggle room when determining tax liability