4 ms·

I think it's important to distinguish between the existence of a diagnosis, the time at which the diagnosis became possible to record and the prevalence of over

I think it's important to distinguish between the existence of a diagnosis, the time at which the diagnosis became possible to record and the prevalence of overdiagnosis. Because if you blur these together, you can hurt people who genuinely need help.

DoreenMichele 9y ago
Mental models for the problem determine how we address it. A good demonstration of that idea is in an old joke about a doctor who castrated a guy when larger underwear would have been an equally valid way to cure his headaches.* If people with ADHD need, for example, better nutrition and are being given drugs instead, they may currently be getting harmed. * http://jokes4us.com/dirtyjokes/castrationjoke.html http://jokes4us.com/dirtyjokes/castrationjoke.html
- jacques_chester 9y ago
  On the whole, I feel your comment assumes that 1) psychiatrists are willfully ignorant of the spectrum of causes and treatments for ADHD and 2) there is some innate advantage to non-medical treatment that is being deliberately overlooked. Given how much the three psychiatrists I've worked with have tested my health, inquired about my diet, given instructions about alcohol consumption, sent me for extensive blood tests, tracked my weight and blood pressure, I feel perhaps this isn't the case at all. Maybe the experts have expertise. And maybe your anecdotal experience and my very different anecdotal experience are not medical proof of anything.
  - DoreenMichele 9y ago
    Or maybe the experts are talented at extracting money while looking good. That's not a talent I have. I remain quite poor. I was a mom trying to do right by my kids. That's it. I think I did right by my kids. I spent a lot of time on parent support groups talking to mostly other moms who often disagreed with the well paid experts writing their kids off and making a pretty penny in the process. Our entire medical system makes its money off of ongoing treatment, not off of actually fixing anything. And you might pause and wonder for a minute about that inherent conflict of interest before fanboying your experts any further.
    - jacques_chester 9y ago
      I appreciate that you want to do right by your children. I'm glad you wound up with a better situation under conditions of misdiagnosis. When medication is clearly unnecessary, I agree that better not to. But it is not true to say that every single case is the same. Making universal statements about the nature of ADHD and universal statements about available treatments can deter people from seeking and receiving help that would work for them. Experts are more likely to diagnose correctly than layfolk. No single error changes that fact. Insofar as people are deterred from seeking expert attention, the net effect is harmful. Attributing the differences in our experiences to a uniform medical conspiracy against the public doesn't bear on whether treatments work or not for different cases. My parents cared too. Nobody told them about ADHD, because it just wasn't a commonly-known thing in that time and place. I was smart enough to stumble forward through school, with their love and heartbreak and the dedication of many frustrated teachers. But I would've done a lot better with just a little treatment. And I find it hard not to take personally the idea that others should be discouraged from seeking help from a professional.
      - DoreenMichele 9y ago
        I am sorry you are taking this so extremely personally. I wish you had stated that up front. I regret engaging you. You are wildly misconstruing my remarks in a very hostile fashion.
        newfoundglory 9y ago
        You seem to be wildly over reacting, I don’t see hostility in his comments.
        DoreenMichele 9y ago
        Among other things, I am being framed as a conspiracy theorist: Attributing the differences in our experiences to a uniform medical conspiracy against the public doesn't bear on whether treatments work or not for different cases. Accusing me of wildly overreacting is not a good way to help in such a situation. It just puts out the fire with gasoline.

DoreenMichele 9y ago

Mental models for the problem determine how we address it. A good demonstration of that idea is in an old joke about a doctor who castrated a guy when larger underwear would have been an equally valid way to cure his headaches.* If people with ADHD need, for example, better nutrition and are being given drugs instead, they may currently be getting harmed. * http://jokes4us.com/dirtyjokes/castrationjoke.html http://jokes4us.com/dirtyjokes/castrationjoke.html

jacques_chester 9y ago
On the whole, I feel your comment assumes that 1) psychiatrists are willfully ignorant of the spectrum of causes and treatments for ADHD and 2) there is some innate advantage to non-medical treatment that is being deliberately overlooked. Given how much the three psychiatrists I've worked with have tested my health, inquired about my diet, given instructions about alcohol consumption, sent me for extensive blood tests, tracked my weight and blood pressure, I feel perhaps this isn't the case at all. Maybe the experts have expertise. And maybe your anecdotal experience and my very different anecdotal experience are not medical proof of anything.
- DoreenMichele 9y ago
  Or maybe the experts are talented at extracting money while looking good. That's not a talent I have. I remain quite poor. I was a mom trying to do right by my kids. That's it. I think I did right by my kids. I spent a lot of time on parent support groups talking to mostly other moms who often disagreed with the well paid experts writing their kids off and making a pretty penny in the process. Our entire medical system makes its money off of ongoing treatment, not off of actually fixing anything. And you might pause and wonder for a minute about that inherent conflict of interest before fanboying your experts any further.
  - jacques_chester 9y ago
    I appreciate that you want to do right by your children. I'm glad you wound up with a better situation under conditions of misdiagnosis. When medication is clearly unnecessary, I agree that better not to. But it is not true to say that every single case is the same. Making universal statements about the nature of ADHD and universal statements about available treatments can deter people from seeking and receiving help that would work for them. Experts are more likely to diagnose correctly than layfolk. No single error changes that fact. Insofar as people are deterred from seeking expert attention, the net effect is harmful. Attributing the differences in our experiences to a uniform medical conspiracy against the public doesn't bear on whether treatments work or not for different cases. My parents cared too. Nobody told them about ADHD, because it just wasn't a commonly-known thing in that time and place. I was smart enough to stumble forward through school, with their love and heartbreak and the dedication of many frustrated teachers. But I would've done a lot better with just a little treatment. And I find it hard not to take personally the idea that others should be discouraged from seeking help from a professional.
    - DoreenMichele 9y ago
      I am sorry you are taking this so extremely personally. I wish you had stated that up front. I regret engaging you. You are wildly misconstruing my remarks in a very hostile fashion.
      - newfoundglory 9y ago
        You seem to be wildly over reacting, I don’t see hostility in his comments.
        DoreenMichele 9y ago
        Among other things, I am being framed as a conspiracy theorist: Attributing the differences in our experiences to a uniform medical conspiracy against the public doesn't bear on whether treatments work or not for different cases. Accusing me of wildly overreacting is not a good way to help in such a situation. It just puts out the fire with gasoline.