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It's absolutely true that you should be nice to people, but let me also issue a similar warning to newcomers not to ask questions in a way that inspires rage.

It's absolutely true that you should be nice to people, but let me also issue a similar warning to newcomers not to ask questions in a way that inspires rage. Programming is, in a very abstract sense, a dirty job. We get paid well, have great benefits, perks, and mobility, but we are the toilet scrubbers of the software world. We spend whole days hunting semicolons, or trying to reverse engineer bug reports that no one remembers writing. I've spent a whole week trying to move a button over about an inch in all supported browsers just to make the product "pixel perfect". I've spent a whole month trying to figure out how to use a SaaS feature as advertised that had sparse documentation and no tech support. Some newcomers really don't understand/believe that, and think it's acceptable to run for help every time something frustrates them... do everyone a favor and don't be that person, please.

godzillabrennus 9y ago
So you advocate for less communication? Why not create a culture that embraces having new comers ask questions in a non disruptive way? Something like a slack channel where experienced dev's can chime in if they have time. I'd freak out on anyone on my team if they were telling new hires not to ask questions. That's just stupid.
- falcolas 9y ago
  My experience: If you come with a question and the steps you've already taken, the research you've already done, you will rarely if ever get a poor response from developers (or at least those who are decent human beings). So, don't start with Slack. Start with the docs, then google, and then end with Slack (even as just a confirmation of your researched solution).
  - tboyd47 9y ago
    Agreed. I'm not saying don't ask questions. I said "not in a way that inspires rage." Just make sure you do your due diligence first. That's important.
- deleted 9y ago
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tn_ 9y ago
New programmers usually don't have any exposition on what's an acceptable amount to ask and adding snark just deters them from sticking with it.
- tboyd47 9y ago
  Excuse me if it comes off as snarky, but my main point is only to say that development is about three parts frustration and one part progress (and I'm being generous with the progress). You can't skip the frustration; it is what you are paid to do. Newcomers should be made aware of this, not to deter them, but to be transparent about what the job actually entails.
  - OceansOnPluto 9y ago
    But if you constantly get frustrated with newcomers, and another guy is always helpful and calm, the newcomers will gravitate to that other guy. If those newcomers advance, who are they more likely to help out with things? If they go to other companies, who are they likely to give a reference to? Getting frustrated is an emotional response, you don't have to get frustrated.
    - tboyd47 9y ago
      Eventually Mr. Always Helpful And Calm is going to get frustrated, too. It's about instilling the right mindset in newbies and not nurturing dependent work relationships. I like being Mr. Helpful, too, but I also like to see new devs persevere through all the frustration and bust through to the other side. Teach a man to fish, and all that.
      - OceansOnPluto 9y ago
        I guess I just don't have those situations where people keep coming to me and asking me for help over and over again, but even then if there are those people you can sit them down and explain to them to not do that without snapping at them. I've had people snap at me occasionally (not because I was asking for help, more because they were assholes in the course of doing their regular job) and the only thing that happens is I avoided them and kept a written record of the times they'd been unpleasant in case we ever needed to talk to HR. That being said, I don't think it's an eventuality that people will always get frustrated with other people. I've never had anybody inspire "rage" in me in work situations. Other than some times I was working on tv sets and people were screaming.
zebrafish 9y ago
I guess I don't understand the scenario where you're being forced to answer this guys question. Why can't you come back to that question when you're not spending a week trying to move a button on a browser?

godzillabrennus 9y ago

So you advocate for less communication? Why not create a culture that embraces having new comers ask questions in a non disruptive way? Something like a slack channel where experienced dev's can chime in if they have time. I'd freak out on anyone on my team if they were telling new hires not to ask questions. That's just stupid.

falcolas 9y ago
My experience: If you come with a question and the steps you've already taken, the research you've already done, you will rarely if ever get a poor response from developers (or at least those who are decent human beings). So, don't start with Slack. Start with the docs, then google, and then end with Slack (even as just a confirmation of your researched solution).
- tboyd47 9y ago
  Agreed. I'm not saying don't ask questions. I said "not in a way that inspires rage." Just make sure you do your due diligence first. That's important.
deleted 9y ago
[deleted]

tn_ 9y ago

New programmers usually don't have any exposition on what's an acceptable amount to ask and adding snark just deters them from sticking with it.

tboyd47 9y ago
Excuse me if it comes off as snarky, but my main point is only to say that development is about three parts frustration and one part progress (and I'm being generous with the progress). You can't skip the frustration; it is what you are paid to do. Newcomers should be made aware of this, not to deter them, but to be transparent about what the job actually entails.
- OceansOnPluto 9y ago
  But if you constantly get frustrated with newcomers, and another guy is always helpful and calm, the newcomers will gravitate to that other guy. If those newcomers advance, who are they more likely to help out with things? If they go to other companies, who are they likely to give a reference to? Getting frustrated is an emotional response, you don't have to get frustrated.
  - tboyd47 9y ago
    Eventually Mr. Always Helpful And Calm is going to get frustrated, too. It's about instilling the right mindset in newbies and not nurturing dependent work relationships. I like being Mr. Helpful, too, but I also like to see new devs persevere through all the frustration and bust through to the other side. Teach a man to fish, and all that.
    - OceansOnPluto 9y ago
      I guess I just don't have those situations where people keep coming to me and asking me for help over and over again, but even then if there are those people you can sit them down and explain to them to not do that without snapping at them. I've had people snap at me occasionally (not because I was asking for help, more because they were assholes in the course of doing their regular job) and the only thing that happens is I avoided them and kept a written record of the times they'd been unpleasant in case we ever needed to talk to HR. That being said, I don't think it's an eventuality that people will always get frustrated with other people. I've never had anybody inspire "rage" in me in work situations. Other than some times I was working on tv sets and people were screaming.

zebrafish 9y ago

I guess I don't understand the scenario where you're being forced to answer this guys question. Why can't you come back to that question when you're not spending a week trying to move a button on a browser?