4 ms·

Everyone always leads in with the "I thought it was useless" bit. Did they really? Haven't they used a digital picture frame and though "Gosh, wouldn't it be c

by ergo98 16y ago

Everyone always leads in with the "I thought it was useless" bit. Did they really? Haven't they used a digital picture frame and though "Gosh, wouldn't it be cool if this could show the weather...and had a web browser...and let me play movies from my server..." I find it difficult to believe that so many intelligent people (of which jwz is definitely one) purportedly couldn't see the obvious appeal. I've been using small devices as PMPs for a while (whether smartphone or touch or zune) and the desire for something larger is, again, obvious. Though I'll hold my breath for the Galasy S Tab.

arebop 16y ago
> Haven't they used a digital picture frame and though "Gosh, wouldn't it be cool if this could show the weather...and had a web browser...and let me play movies from my server..." Yes, I have had those thoughts. I also thought "I'd be willing to pay $5 for that. Oh well." So sure I understand that these things are appealing for coffee tables or salesmen, but I (still) don't see myself using one very much.
- loewenskind 16y ago
  Is there anything you would pay a realistic price for? You seem to vastly undervalue what things are worth. Of course you'll probably say "that's what it's worth to me", but is that correct? Is the time saving and convenience really only bringing $5 worth of value to your life? That would mean it saves you about an hour of time across the entire lifetime of the product (assuming a very low value for what your time is worth).
  - arebop 16y ago
    Yes, I do buy other things. As for time savings and convenience, even having used the iPad for a few minutes one day, I don't think it would save me any time at all compared to using my laptop. iPad is less convenient for carrying around than my Android phone, and its software keyboard makes it less convenient for programming than my MacBook Pro. Yes I know I could add an external keyboard, but then I would have to haul around two pieces instead of one, and I'd still be stuck programming on a 9.7" display.
    - loewenskind 16y ago
      You should try out the keyboard in landscape mode. It's probably not as bad as you expect. I make a lot of errors but the software corrects them so well that I usually just ignore them and touch type at nearly normal typing speed. There are also shortcuts, like double space terminates the current sentence and starts the next, turning dont into don't, etc.
gamble 16y ago
It is a $500+ device. At that point most people are looking for some guarantee that it's going to be useful. The iPad is an unusual product, because doesn't address an obvious need. Laptops were just portable desktops. mp3 players were digital Walkmans. Smartphones are a combination of PDA, mp3 player, and phones. Most new classes of electronics are just an extension of an existing product in an obvious but technically-challenging direction. The iPad is more like the original PC - superficially similar to its predecessors, but used quite differently. People use their iPads in their own way. For me, the killer app was as an e-reader. I could easily read books and pdfs on my laptop, but the tablet form-factor is far more pleasant for reading. Reading on a laptop is a chore, whereas reading on the iPad feels quite natural. What trips people up about the iPad is that it isn't about the functionality. My MBP is more capable in almost every way. It's value lies in the fact that it does certain things extremely well that no other electronic device has been good at until now.
- ido 16y ago
  The iPad is more like the original PC - superficially similar to its predecessors, but used quite differently. A bit OT, but how was using the original PC categorically different than using an apple2/atari 800/trs-80/etc?
  - arethuza 16y ago
    I think IBM branding had a lot to do with it - as it was made by IBM it was a serious business tool whereas other devices were merely "toys". Of course this had nothing to do with the capabilities of the technologies but everything to do with positioning.
    - glhaynes 16y ago
      I expect the original poster doesn't mean the IBM PC specifically, but personal computers in general.
  - listic 16y ago
    I think he meant to say that PC is superficially similar, but different from the computers of previous era: terminals connected to mainframes.
jerf 16y ago
'Everyone always leads in with the "I thought it was useless" bit.' Experience. The iPad is far from the first device in the tablet form factor, and far from the first tablet device to promise a revolution. It is, after all, not even the first Apple tablet device. I think the problem has been that tablets have always lagged behind even laptops in what they could afford in terms of processing power and such; it wasn't until the Great Stagnation of CPU speeds and the relatively recent focus on low-watt-yet-powerful CPUs and GPUs that the segment became viable. No longer does it feel like you've stepped ten years back in time when you turn on a tablet. You have, except with a much better graphics card, but a ten year old-ish machine with a better graphics card is still a decent machine for most uses, so you don't feel it. Smartphones rode the same wave a few years ago. (Plus the work on faster browsers helps a lot too, even an older machine feels a lot faster on those.) It's also pretty easy to think that a laptop is good enough. I know, because I still think a laptop is good enough for me. Perhaps my usage is abnormal but I spend a lot of time on my laptop typing, and I don't just mean for programming.
ido 16y ago
Haven't they used a digital picture frame and though "Gosh, wouldn't it be cool if this could show the weather...and had a web browser...and let me play movies from my server..." I never saw a digital picture frame, let alone used one - and my initial reaction was to think those would be pretty useless :)

by ergo98 16y ago

arebop 16y ago

> Haven't they used a digital picture frame and though "Gosh, wouldn't it be cool if this could show the weather...and had a web browser...and let me play movies from my server..." Yes, I have had those thoughts. I also thought "I'd be willing to pay $5 for that. Oh well." So sure I understand that these things are appealing for coffee tables or salesmen, but I (still) don't see myself using one very much.

loewenskind 16y ago
Is there anything you would pay a realistic price for? You seem to vastly undervalue what things are worth. Of course you'll probably say "that's what it's worth to me", but is that correct? Is the time saving and convenience really only bringing $5 worth of value to your life? That would mean it saves you about an hour of time across the entire lifetime of the product (assuming a very low value for what your time is worth).
- arebop 16y ago
  Yes, I do buy other things. As for time savings and convenience, even having used the iPad for a few minutes one day, I don't think it would save me any time at all compared to using my laptop. iPad is less convenient for carrying around than my Android phone, and its software keyboard makes it less convenient for programming than my MacBook Pro. Yes I know I could add an external keyboard, but then I would have to haul around two pieces instead of one, and I'd still be stuck programming on a 9.7" display.
  - loewenskind 16y ago
    You should try out the keyboard in landscape mode. It's probably not as bad as you expect. I make a lot of errors but the software corrects them so well that I usually just ignore them and touch type at nearly normal typing speed. There are also shortcuts, like double space terminates the current sentence and starts the next, turning dont into don't, etc.

gamble 16y ago

It is a $500+ device. At that point most people are looking for some guarantee that it's going to be useful. The iPad is an unusual product, because doesn't address an obvious need. Laptops were just portable desktops. mp3 players were digital Walkmans. Smartphones are a combination of PDA, mp3 player, and phones. Most new classes of electronics are just an extension of an existing product in an obvious but technically-challenging direction. The iPad is more like the original PC - superficially similar to its predecessors, but used quite differently. People use their iPads in their own way. For me, the killer app was as an e-reader. I could easily read books and pdfs on my laptop, but the tablet form-factor is far more pleasant for reading. Reading on a laptop is a chore, whereas reading on the iPad feels quite natural. What trips people up about the iPad is that it isn't about the functionality. My MBP is more capable in almost every way. It's value lies in the fact that it does certain things extremely well that no other electronic device has been good at until now.

ido 16y ago
The iPad is more like the original PC - superficially similar to its predecessors, but used quite differently. A bit OT, but how was using the original PC categorically different than using an apple2/atari 800/trs-80/etc?
- arethuza 16y ago
  I think IBM branding had a lot to do with it - as it was made by IBM it was a serious business tool whereas other devices were merely "toys". Of course this had nothing to do with the capabilities of the technologies but everything to do with positioning.
  - glhaynes 16y ago
    I expect the original poster doesn't mean the IBM PC specifically, but personal computers in general.
- listic 16y ago
  I think he meant to say that PC is superficially similar, but different from the computers of previous era: terminals connected to mainframes.

jerf 16y ago

'Everyone always leads in with the "I thought it was useless" bit.' Experience. The iPad is far from the first device in the tablet form factor, and far from the first tablet device to promise a revolution. It is, after all, not even the first Apple tablet device. I think the problem has been that tablets have always lagged behind even laptops in what they could afford in terms of processing power and such; it wasn't until the Great Stagnation of CPU speeds and the relatively recent focus on low-watt-yet-powerful CPUs and GPUs that the segment became viable. No longer does it feel like you've stepped ten years back in time when you turn on a tablet. You have, except with a much better graphics card, but a ten year old-ish machine with a better graphics card is still a decent machine for most uses, so you don't feel it. Smartphones rode the same wave a few years ago. (Plus the work on faster browsers helps a lot too, even an older machine feels a lot faster on those.) It's also pretty easy to think that a laptop is good enough. I know, because I still think a laptop is good enough for me. Perhaps my usage is abnormal but I spend a lot of time on my laptop typing, and I don't just mean for programming.

ido 16y ago

Haven't they used a digital picture frame and though "Gosh, wouldn't it be cool if this could show the weather...and had a web browser...and let me play movies from my server..." I never saw a digital picture frame, let alone used one - and my initial reaction was to think those would be pretty useless :)