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>What goes into these people's minds? Can someone shed some light? Maybe I can shed _some_ light. I worked for one of the big music streaming services for a w

>What goes into these people's minds? Can someone shed some light? Maybe I can shed _some_ light. I worked for one of the big music streaming services for a while. >limited valuable real estate on a mobile device. Maximizing data density on a screen is absolutely not a goal on any 'large audience' app. Yes, an app with tons of data crammed on a screen would make some folks happy in the HN/geeky communities (I am not sure that's true actually, but that's something that I often see power users asking for). That's not who these apps are targeting though. The design of these apps is often a mix between opinionated choices (basically what is trendy right now in the design circles) and what works in user testing. Turns out, most of our users are ABSOLUTELY lost when they have to interact with a mobile app. Music streaming services have way too many features : albums playlists radios some kind of AI powered automatically created track lists (all services give this a different name, but they all have pretty much the same feature) lyrics, podcasts On top of that, there is a ton of data for every single track : title album artist composer !!!! (classical music treatment is usually awful in any streaming app) . has lyrics ? is downloaded on your device ? The player adds another layer of complexity : current track queue random mode repeat mode Here is the dirty little secret of the music streaming industry : how to present all this in a way that allows random users (not geeks) to efficiently interact with the app : nobody knows how to do that :/ . There is just way too many information to cram on a screen. To pile on that, usual development cycles are focused on releasing new features, either to keep up with the competition or because that's how PMs demonstrate that they are 'improving' the app. It is orthogonal to actually improving the user experience and we can see cycles of several years where the UI becomes more and more bloated with random stuff until designers are able to push a redesign with half of the features. And soon we start cramming features again until the end of this new cycle.

fermienrico 9y ago
I think there is a balance between something that looks like Apple Music and an excel spreadsheet full of information. Apple Music is way out of the normal density expected from a quality app. Apple has a phenomenal understanding of UI and they're one of the best - just look at the UI of the settings menu on your iPhone. Everything is cleanly laid out - just the right amount of information density. Apple Music seems like it was designed by someone like Will-I-Am (sorry :-) ) with absolutely zero understanding of basic functional UI principles. If I were to design UI, I'd design it like how aviation does cockpits. Functional, not "trendy". Everything has a reason - if you can't explain "WHY", you shouldn't be designing UI. Personal taste, subjective opinions, "I kinda like it that way" doesn't work in aviation industry. Please don't take it as I mean Apple to follow the same principles, I am just mentioning the other end of the spectrum in UI design to provide contrast.
- asimpletune 9y ago
  Then do it! I’d be super interested to see what you come up with. Even if it’s drawn on paper.
- pducks32 9y ago
  I’m not a designer but I’ve thought a lot about this just cuz I find it interesting from a data organization POV and I like music. I think Apple deserves some credit in terms of this. Music.app is no iTunes but ask Siri who plays the drums and her answer is great. It’s bad at the difference between Studio Album and album of 1 song/remixes etc. if you have an idea how you’d like it laid out I would be interested to see.
- on_and_off 9y ago
  >Everything has a reason - if you can't explain "WHY", you shouldn't be designing UI . oh UI design in such an app always has a why Before doing any modification on the UI of such an app, a lot of attention is given to user data. It can't be completely objective because at the end of the day any interpretation of user data is at least a bit subjective (and generally way more than that). It does aim at being data driven though.
  - 220V_USKettle 9y ago
    How does one prevent data-driven design from becoming a self-fulfilling prophecy?
    - pjmlp 9y ago
      A/B testing with groups of random people put together in a room, using unreleased versions of the application.
    - on_and_off 9y ago
      You don't :/ Again at some point there is a part of subjectivity in how you analyze the dataset. It is still better than having no idea what your users are doing with your product.
- 9y ago
n-gauge 9y ago
One of my pet projects was 'emoticon select' where it would analyse the users face and play a song relating to how they feel. No playlists needed.
thegranderson 9y ago
Where do you think Spotify's mobile app falls in this landscape? I would argue it is a great balance between new user needs (the Home and Discover areas), with most power user needs in the playlist/search/playback portions. It isn't perfect, but it actually feels like an app designed to be used to play back music. Apple Music feels like a big, clunky, advertisement.
- gnud 9y ago
  The really big thing missing in the spotify mobile client, is being able to see the whole title of songs/albums when looking through a playlist.
- KozmoNau7 9y ago
  Another thing that's missing from the Spotify app is the ability to play a whole playlist folder, not just individual playlists.
- on_and_off 9y ago
  I would say it is pretty standard. There is usually some degree of uniformity in streaming apps : - all the services tend to get the same deals from the majors. Let's say service x gets terms A, service y will push to have the same A. - they all solve the same problem . Personally, I am not a big fan of spotify's UI : - I despise Blur, it is the autotune of design and Spotify uses it a lot. - As much as I like an app that is easier on my eyes without all these white areas everywhere, spotify is way too dark for my taste . - it is surprisingly unpolished for such a big mobile team. To be fair a lot of the complexity is self imposed and comes from the fact that the UI is rendered based on the configuration sent by the server (display 3 columns of artists, etc) Spotify does shine on the playback tech though. ogg vorbis, loudness equalization, etc they are on top of their game here.
thirdsun 9y ago
> Here is the dirty little secret of the music streaming industry : how to present all this in a way that allows random users (not geeks) to efficiently interact with the app : nobody knows how to do that :/ I said it before and I'll say it again: Rdio knew. In my opinion the best streaming service for music enthusiasts and casual listeners alike.

fermienrico 9y ago

I think there is a balance between something that looks like Apple Music and an excel spreadsheet full of information. Apple Music is way out of the normal density expected from a quality app. Apple has a phenomenal understanding of UI and they're one of the best - just look at the UI of the settings menu on your iPhone. Everything is cleanly laid out - just the right amount of information density. Apple Music seems like it was designed by someone like Will-I-Am (sorry :-) ) with absolutely zero understanding of basic functional UI principles. If I were to design UI, I'd design it like how aviation does cockpits. Functional, not "trendy". Everything has a reason - if you can't explain "WHY", you shouldn't be designing UI. Personal taste, subjective opinions, "I kinda like it that way" doesn't work in aviation industry. Please don't take it as I mean Apple to follow the same principles, I am just mentioning the other end of the spectrum in UI design to provide contrast.

asimpletune 9y ago
Then do it! I’d be super interested to see what you come up with. Even if it’s drawn on paper.
pducks32 9y ago
I’m not a designer but I’ve thought a lot about this just cuz I find it interesting from a data organization POV and I like music. I think Apple deserves some credit in terms of this. Music.app is no iTunes but ask Siri who plays the drums and her answer is great. It’s bad at the difference between Studio Album and album of 1 song/remixes etc. if you have an idea how you’d like it laid out I would be interested to see.
on_and_off 9y ago
>Everything has a reason - if you can't explain "WHY", you shouldn't be designing UI . oh UI design in such an app always has a why Before doing any modification on the UI of such an app, a lot of attention is given to user data. It can't be completely objective because at the end of the day any interpretation of user data is at least a bit subjective (and generally way more than that). It does aim at being data driven though.
- 220V_USKettle 9y ago
  How does one prevent data-driven design from becoming a self-fulfilling prophecy?
  - pjmlp 9y ago
    A/B testing with groups of random people put together in a room, using unreleased versions of the application.
  - on_and_off 9y ago
    You don't :/ Again at some point there is a part of subjectivity in how you analyze the dataset. It is still better than having no idea what your users are doing with your product.
9y ago

n-gauge 9y ago

One of my pet projects was 'emoticon select' where it would analyse the users face and play a song relating to how they feel. No playlists needed.

thegranderson 9y ago

Where do you think Spotify's mobile app falls in this landscape? I would argue it is a great balance between new user needs (the Home and Discover areas), with most power user needs in the playlist/search/playback portions. It isn't perfect, but it actually feels like an app designed to be used to play back music. Apple Music feels like a big, clunky, advertisement.

gnud 9y ago
The really big thing missing in the spotify mobile client, is being able to see the whole title of songs/albums when looking through a playlist.
KozmoNau7 9y ago
Another thing that's missing from the Spotify app is the ability to play a whole playlist folder, not just individual playlists.
on_and_off 9y ago
I would say it is pretty standard. There is usually some degree of uniformity in streaming apps : - all the services tend to get the same deals from the majors. Let's say service x gets terms A, service y will push to have the same A. - they all solve the same problem . Personally, I am not a big fan of spotify's UI : - I despise Blur, it is the autotune of design and Spotify uses it a lot. - As much as I like an app that is easier on my eyes without all these white areas everywhere, spotify is way too dark for my taste . - it is surprisingly unpolished for such a big mobile team. To be fair a lot of the complexity is self imposed and comes from the fact that the UI is rendered based on the configuration sent by the server (display 3 columns of artists, etc) Spotify does shine on the playback tech though. ogg vorbis, loudness equalization, etc they are on top of their game here.

thirdsun 9y ago

> Here is the dirty little secret of the music streaming industry : how to present all this in a way that allows random users (not geeks) to efficiently interact with the app : nobody knows how to do that :/ I said it before and I'll say it again: Rdio knew. In my opinion the best streaming service for music enthusiasts and casual listeners alike.