7 ms·

It's moronic. These retailers know whether you recently purchased the item you're returning. Why are they counting it against you?

mattnewton 9y ago
Agreed, this seems to turn a simple database lookup into a ml classification problem.. presumably this only happens for people who don’t provide a phone number or name?
cookiecaper 9y ago
Because recent buyers are among the prime suspects for abuse, since some people will exploit retailers' lenient return policies as a free rental service. They'll buy something expensive, use it a handful of times during the conventional 30-day return window, and then return the used, depreciated item to the store for a full refund. This item then has to be liquidated or refurbished, but even if it didn't, you've still probably lost the margin you made on it just by handling the return. Margins per unit are in typically in the realm of a few bucks, at best. Pennies count in retail. You can get away with this a few times, but more than that, and a backend system like this will flag you as a "serial returner" and instruct the staff to refuse your return. It'd be great if they could make it easy to allow managerial override, but unfortunately, many managers or other store employees work in cahoots with civilian accomplices to rip off the retailers with this type of scheme.
- bkohlmann 9y ago
  I’m perplexed why this comment is being downvoted. I found it informative, plausible and well reasoned. That said, if there is evidence against the authors position, I’d love to see it to better help my understanding.
- raincom 9y ago
  Yeah, that’s how expensive cameras were abused in old days with 30 day return policies and without restocking fees. Thanks to this, the return window is 14 days along with restocking fees for electronics items.
- michaelmrose 9y ago
  I find it profoundly unlikely that anyone is risking their salaried positions to help neighbor bob free rent a few tools.
  - nickpsecurity 9y ago
    Walmart operates in a lot of areas where the jobs are all dead end, low paying, or treat workers poorly. They do a lot of that themselves. It's why they have high turnover and theft among employees. They still have high turnover and theft after upping their wages. I rarely see the same person twice at the local one. In such environments, the people who are used to pulling for each other with favors will certainly do things at the companies' expense for friends or in trade for anothers' items. They figure they'll be at another crap job in near future or just won't get prosecuted, that Walmart is a racket not giving them anything for their work, that they're corporate evil that deserve no sympathy, and so on so forth. So, why not get something in return or hook their friends up while they're there?" they'll ask. That's how some explained it to me that were fired for stealing or doing stuff for friends at various retail places. They're so good at risk assessment they tell people like me they barely know about what they do. It's unreal lol. Note: I ran into this stuff mostly in low-income areas both city and rural. Gets worse if the management treats workers worse.
- nickpsecurity 9y ago
  "Because recent buyers are among the prime suspects for abuse, since some people will exploit retailers' lenient return policies as a free rental service. They'll buy something expensive, use it a handful of times during the conventional 30-day return window, and then return the used, depreciated item to the store for a full refund." I've met people who have bragged about doing that. So, it's a real thing. I always wondered if AutoZone's tool lending policy for customers was to just to help them or to partly counter people buying/returning tools just to fix an immediate problem. The main difference is the tool lending process requires them to hold your ID until you give the stuff back. Plus, it's a spare set in the back whose use doesn't reduce value of their main stuff. I bet Walmart gets hit with hundreds of thousands to millions a year worth of returns for one-off uses of their products alone. Especially automotive or home improvement.
  - toomuchtodo 9y ago
    Autozone’s tool rental (free) sells parts they sell, parts you might not otherwise be able to install without those tools.
  - wiseleo 9y ago
    They definitely do not hold your ID, except perhaps to lend you the tools to replace your battery in the parking lot. Forcing a customer to drive without a hard copy of the driver license is not smart. The deposit you pay to rent the tool is identical to the purchase price. This is true for several states, including California. Some of their rentable tools are better than the tools available for retail sale while costing less or including better accessories like a sturdy case. I kept several rental tools. I rented a few with intent to purchase them and told that to the store personnel so they could order a replacement. One of my favorite tools is a serpentine belt wrench. The rental version comes with a case and a couple of extra crow foot wrenches. The retail version has fewer accessories and no case. Some locations now only rent for 48 hours. I had no problem returning those rentals after a week. Replacing suspension components often requires specialty tools.
    - nickpsecurity 9y ago
- mc32 9y ago
  Not sure if it's still a thing, but I knew of people who'd buy something for a special occasion and then return it after the occasion or special event was over. I'm sure retail apparel is not oblivious to this practice.
- bestbuyguy1234 9y ago
  One scheme I saw while employed at a Best Buy store many years ago. Employee uses employee discount to purchase greatly overpriced $35 usb cable for employee cost $5. Non-employee accomplice returns cable without receipt and receives store credit for $35. Rinse and repeat. I assume that loop hole has been closed, but it was my department manager's sibling who first explained this to me.
michaelmrose 9y ago
In every instance where they can verify you purchased it returning it is a snap.

mattnewton 9y ago

Agreed, this seems to turn a simple database lookup into a ml classification problem.. presumably this only happens for people who don’t provide a phone number or name?

cookiecaper 9y ago

Because recent buyers are among the prime suspects for abuse, since some people will exploit retailers' lenient return policies as a free rental service. They'll buy something expensive, use it a handful of times during the conventional 30-day return window, and then return the used, depreciated item to the store for a full refund. This item then has to be liquidated or refurbished, but even if it didn't, you've still probably lost the margin you made on it just by handling the return. Margins per unit are in typically in the realm of a few bucks, at best. Pennies count in retail. You can get away with this a few times, but more than that, and a backend system like this will flag you as a "serial returner" and instruct the staff to refuse your return. It'd be great if they could make it easy to allow managerial override, but unfortunately, many managers or other store employees work in cahoots with civilian accomplices to rip off the retailers with this type of scheme.

bkohlmann 9y ago
I’m perplexed why this comment is being downvoted. I found it informative, plausible and well reasoned. That said, if there is evidence against the authors position, I’d love to see it to better help my understanding.
raincom 9y ago
Yeah, that’s how expensive cameras were abused in old days with 30 day return policies and without restocking fees. Thanks to this, the return window is 14 days along with restocking fees for electronics items.
michaelmrose 9y ago
I find it profoundly unlikely that anyone is risking their salaried positions to help neighbor bob free rent a few tools.
- nickpsecurity 9y ago
  Walmart operates in a lot of areas where the jobs are all dead end, low paying, or treat workers poorly. They do a lot of that themselves. It's why they have high turnover and theft among employees. They still have high turnover and theft after upping their wages. I rarely see the same person twice at the local one. In such environments, the people who are used to pulling for each other with favors will certainly do things at the companies' expense for friends or in trade for anothers' items. They figure they'll be at another crap job in near future or just won't get prosecuted, that Walmart is a racket not giving them anything for their work, that they're corporate evil that deserve no sympathy, and so on so forth. So, why not get something in return or hook their friends up while they're there?" they'll ask. That's how some explained it to me that were fired for stealing or doing stuff for friends at various retail places. They're so good at risk assessment they tell people like me they barely know about what they do. It's unreal lol. Note: I ran into this stuff mostly in low-income areas both city and rural. Gets worse if the management treats workers worse.
nickpsecurity 9y ago
"Because recent buyers are among the prime suspects for abuse, since some people will exploit retailers' lenient return policies as a free rental service. They'll buy something expensive, use it a handful of times during the conventional 30-day return window, and then return the used, depreciated item to the store for a full refund." I've met people who have bragged about doing that. So, it's a real thing. I always wondered if AutoZone's tool lending policy for customers was to just to help them or to partly counter people buying/returning tools just to fix an immediate problem. The main difference is the tool lending process requires them to hold your ID until you give the stuff back. Plus, it's a spare set in the back whose use doesn't reduce value of their main stuff. I bet Walmart gets hit with hundreds of thousands to millions a year worth of returns for one-off uses of their products alone. Especially automotive or home improvement.
- toomuchtodo 9y ago
  Autozone’s tool rental (free) sells parts they sell, parts you might not otherwise be able to install without those tools.
- wiseleo 9y ago
  They definitely do not hold your ID, except perhaps to lend you the tools to replace your battery in the parking lot. Forcing a customer to drive without a hard copy of the driver license is not smart. The deposit you pay to rent the tool is identical to the purchase price. This is true for several states, including California. Some of their rentable tools are better than the tools available for retail sale while costing less or including better accessories like a sturdy case. I kept several rental tools. I rented a few with intent to purchase them and told that to the store personnel so they could order a replacement. One of my favorite tools is a serpentine belt wrench. The rental version comes with a case and a couple of extra crow foot wrenches. The retail version has fewer accessories and no case. Some locations now only rent for 48 hours. I had no problem returning those rentals after a week. Replacing suspension components often requires specialty tools.
  - nickpsecurity 9y ago
mc32 9y ago
Not sure if it's still a thing, but I knew of people who'd buy something for a special occasion and then return it after the occasion or special event was over. I'm sure retail apparel is not oblivious to this practice.
bestbuyguy1234 9y ago
One scheme I saw while employed at a Best Buy store many years ago. Employee uses employee discount to purchase greatly overpriced $35 usb cable for employee cost $5. Non-employee accomplice returns cable without receipt and receives store credit for $35. Rinse and repeat. I assume that loop hole has been closed, but it was my department manager's sibling who first explained this to me.

michaelmrose 9y ago

In every instance where they can verify you purchased it returning it is a snap.