4 ms·

Not quite correct. We've tried: - Real identities (Facebook comments) - Voting and self moderation (Reddit, HN, etc.) - Strong moderation (Reddit, HN) All

Not quite correct. We've tried: - Real identities (Facebook comments) - Voting and self moderation (Reddit, HN, etc.) - Strong moderation (Reddit, HN) All within the context of rampant financialisation, land policies returning us to feudalism and continuous lying about the banking bailout including removing the one candidate who was going to take on the banks (Bernie). Maybe it's not "the internet" that's the problem. Maybe the dissemination of information as we slide into this rentier hellpit is causing people to be pretty pissed off?

rexpop 9y ago
How can I read up on these land policies?
- branchless 9y ago
  I don't like "the economist" however a while back they did do a piece on land value tax, maybe HN will find it more palatable coming from this journal: https://www.economist.com/blogs/freeexchange/2015/04/land-value-tax https://www.economist.com/blogs/freeexchange/2015/04/land-va...
- thaumasiotes 9y ago
  Here's what I know or believe I know about feudalism. It's almost entirely from the book https://www.amazon.com/Pre-Industrial-Societies-Anatomy-Pre-Modern-World-ebook/dp/B00XTAXZAU/ https://www.amazon.com/Pre-Industrial-Societies-Anatomy-Pre-... , which while excellent does not deal with feudalism in any depth. - European feudalism was an unusual system in that the government had no taxing power. The lord who owned land held the taxing power ("feudal dues") over that land, and the king funded himself by collecting feudal dues from land he owned personally, rather than e.g. by taxing the dukes. This might contrast with a more advanced state of civilization in which the caliph / emperor / whatever collected taxes directly from everywhere by virtue of being the supreme ruler, and paid a salary to his lower administrative functionaries. Or it might contrast with a system where the use of land wasn't much of a source of taxes. Or both of those latter things might be true simultaneously. The US system of property taxes has a lot in common with the system I've described above, and some obvious differences. Similarities: - The federal government ("king") can't assess property taxes. Only the states ("local lords") can do that. - People other than the government cannot own land outright, but must pay the property tax ("feudal dues") for its use every year. Of course, rather than the federal government receiving tax income based on federally owned land, it instead double-taxes the citizens of the states. (But on mercantile revenue rather than on land.) This is arguably worse than the feudal system.
  - branchless 9y ago
    How are devolved local states equivalent to private landlords? States capture land value via land tax and socialise this. Private landlords capture it and keep it. Night and day.
    - thaumasiotes 9y ago
      Are you referring to a feudal lord as a "private landlord" or a "devolved local state"? Both would be more or less fully appropriate. "Devolved local state" is slightly more accurate than "private landlord", because unlike a landlord in a more commercialized society, a feudal lord was not legally able to sell the land he owned. He was legally able to govern it.
      - branchless 9y ago
        My interest is that the feudal lord was living off the backs of others. The state taxing land to build hospitals is not the same thing.
        thaumasiotes 9y ago
        Lords often got their start in lording by building a bridge.
        rexpop 9y ago
        I would read the heck out of a book that purported this.
        rexpop 9y ago
        You might enjoy Stop, Thief!: The Commons, Enclosures, and Resistance https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/17802312-stop-thief https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/17802312-stop-thief

rexpop 9y ago

How can I read up on these land policies?

branchless 9y ago
I don't like "the economist" however a while back they did do a piece on land value tax, maybe HN will find it more palatable coming from this journal: https://www.economist.com/blogs/freeexchange/2015/04/land-value-tax https://www.economist.com/blogs/freeexchange/2015/04/land-va...
thaumasiotes 9y ago
Here's what I know or believe I know about feudalism. It's almost entirely from the book https://www.amazon.com/Pre-Industrial-Societies-Anatomy-Pre-Modern-World-ebook/dp/B00XTAXZAU/ https://www.amazon.com/Pre-Industrial-Societies-Anatomy-Pre-... , which while excellent does not deal with feudalism in any depth. - European feudalism was an unusual system in that the government had no taxing power. The lord who owned land held the taxing power ("feudal dues") over that land, and the king funded himself by collecting feudal dues from land he owned personally, rather than e.g. by taxing the dukes. This might contrast with a more advanced state of civilization in which the caliph / emperor / whatever collected taxes directly from everywhere by virtue of being the supreme ruler, and paid a salary to his lower administrative functionaries. Or it might contrast with a system where the use of land wasn't much of a source of taxes. Or both of those latter things might be true simultaneously. The US system of property taxes has a lot in common with the system I've described above, and some obvious differences. Similarities: - The federal government ("king") can't assess property taxes. Only the states ("local lords") can do that. - People other than the government cannot own land outright, but must pay the property tax ("feudal dues") for its use every year. Of course, rather than the federal government receiving tax income based on federally owned land, it instead double-taxes the citizens of the states. (But on mercantile revenue rather than on land.) This is arguably worse than the feudal system.
- branchless 9y ago
  How are devolved local states equivalent to private landlords? States capture land value via land tax and socialise this. Private landlords capture it and keep it. Night and day.
  - thaumasiotes 9y ago
    Are you referring to a feudal lord as a "private landlord" or a "devolved local state"? Both would be more or less fully appropriate. "Devolved local state" is slightly more accurate than "private landlord", because unlike a landlord in a more commercialized society, a feudal lord was not legally able to sell the land he owned. He was legally able to govern it.
    - branchless 9y ago
      My interest is that the feudal lord was living off the backs of others. The state taxing land to build hospitals is not the same thing.
      - thaumasiotes 9y ago
        Lords often got their start in lording by building a bridge.
        rexpop 9y ago
        I would read the heck out of a book that purported this.
      - rexpop 9y ago
        You might enjoy Stop, Thief!: The Commons, Enclosures, and Resistance https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/17802312-stop-thief https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/17802312-stop-thief