4 ms·

I find worker-owned businesses very interesting. Obviously getting paid the same regardless of role may be an obstacle to attracting highly skilled people, but

by remir 9y ago

I find worker-owned businesses very interesting. Obviously getting paid the same regardless of role may be an obstacle to attracting highly skilled people, but if salaries are competitive and established in function of role and experience, in a transparent way, that could be great.

wutbrodo 9y ago
Yea, i wondered the same thing. I like the idea of a worker owned Co-op in general, but it's subject to them actually being functional. I don't see how that could be the case with industries with large productivity/talent gaps, like software. Most of the co-ops I've come into contact with are smallish restaurants or grocery stores, which makes sense: most tasks can be handled by anyone and those that aren't can be judged a lot more effectively.
- icebraining 9y ago
  I don't see how that could be the case with industries with large productivity/talent gaps, like software. And yet: https://github.com/hng/tech-coops#coops https://github.com/hng/tech-coops#coops The gaps problem seems self-correcting; anyone who thinks they are underpaid will leave, and conversely the team will probably push out those badly underperforming. You'll still have gaps, but only among people who don't mind getting paid the same despite them.
  - gremlinsinc 9y ago
    Thanks for that link.. lots of good resources... I want to start an MSP (Computer Repair / Maintenance as a Service) + Hosting + Development Business as a worker co-op someday, when I get the free-time and money to do so.
- dragonwriter 9y ago
  > I don't see how that could be the case with industries with large productivity/talent gaps, like software. There are a number of large coops in industries where the firms require everything from professionals to manual labor; equal pay isn't common in those kind of coops, though the pay ranges are probably flatter than conventional firms. A co-op, ultimately, can be very much like a conventional firm, where the voting stock is held equally by the employees, so that management is ultimately accountable to the employees.
  - wutbrodo 9y ago
    Right, I was being imprecise. I didn't mean to refer to coops in general, but rather equal-pay xoops
slavik81 9y ago
Worker cooperatives tend have the problem that it's hard to compare contributions of labour. The coop model tends to work best when most or all the workers are of a similar sort. More cohesion and less resentment that way. That's probably why the company has everyone do every job. Specialists are hard to employ like that, but the trick is that you don't need to hire them. Rather than keeping an accountant in house, you can just contract an accounting firm to handle it. You might not have an in-house lawyer, but you'll be a client for a law firm. That being said, there may be some soul searching when Jim the Janitor complains he's basically a second-class employee because technically he just works for the company you're leasing the building from.
- dragonwriter 9y ago
  > Worker cooperatives tend have the problem that it's hard to compare contributions of labour. Insofar as that's a problem, it's a problem for any firm compensating labor, not just labor cooperatives. Labor cooperatives are perhaps less prone to adopt ad hoc wage differences through mechanisms which permit personal bias to manifest without a good metric with the excuse that it's necessary to reflect differences in contribution.
wolco 9y ago
I was part of a worker owned company as a contractor. I believe it started with a lack of funds to pay employees so they had to trade pay for debt. In the end the Indian division bought out the parent company and closed down the north american offices.

by remir 9y ago

wutbrodo 9y ago

Yea, i wondered the same thing. I like the idea of a worker owned Co-op in general, but it's subject to them actually being functional. I don't see how that could be the case with industries with large productivity/talent gaps, like software. Most of the co-ops I've come into contact with are smallish restaurants or grocery stores, which makes sense: most tasks can be handled by anyone and those that aren't can be judged a lot more effectively.

icebraining 9y ago
I don't see how that could be the case with industries with large productivity/talent gaps, like software. And yet: https://github.com/hng/tech-coops#coops https://github.com/hng/tech-coops#coops The gaps problem seems self-correcting; anyone who thinks they are underpaid will leave, and conversely the team will probably push out those badly underperforming. You'll still have gaps, but only among people who don't mind getting paid the same despite them.
- gremlinsinc 9y ago
  Thanks for that link.. lots of good resources... I want to start an MSP (Computer Repair / Maintenance as a Service) + Hosting + Development Business as a worker co-op someday, when I get the free-time and money to do so.
dragonwriter 9y ago
> I don't see how that could be the case with industries with large productivity/talent gaps, like software. There are a number of large coops in industries where the firms require everything from professionals to manual labor; equal pay isn't common in those kind of coops, though the pay ranges are probably flatter than conventional firms. A co-op, ultimately, can be very much like a conventional firm, where the voting stock is held equally by the employees, so that management is ultimately accountable to the employees.
- wutbrodo 9y ago
  Right, I was being imprecise. I didn't mean to refer to coops in general, but rather equal-pay xoops

slavik81 9y ago

Worker cooperatives tend have the problem that it's hard to compare contributions of labour. The coop model tends to work best when most or all the workers are of a similar sort. More cohesion and less resentment that way. That's probably why the company has everyone do every job. Specialists are hard to employ like that, but the trick is that you don't need to hire them. Rather than keeping an accountant in house, you can just contract an accounting firm to handle it. You might not have an in-house lawyer, but you'll be a client for a law firm. That being said, there may be some soul searching when Jim the Janitor complains he's basically a second-class employee because technically he just works for the company you're leasing the building from.

dragonwriter 9y ago
> Worker cooperatives tend have the problem that it's hard to compare contributions of labour. Insofar as that's a problem, it's a problem for any firm compensating labor, not just labor cooperatives. Labor cooperatives are perhaps less prone to adopt ad hoc wage differences through mechanisms which permit personal bias to manifest without a good metric with the excuse that it's necessary to reflect differences in contribution.

wolco 9y ago

I was part of a worker owned company as a contractor. I believe it started with a lack of funds to pay employees so they had to trade pay for debt. In the end the Indian division bought out the parent company and closed down the north american offices.