4 ms·

Aww, come on. People want and expect websites to be very close to web applications that react to who you are, what actions you take on the page and a myriad of

Aww, come on. People want and expect websites to be very close to web applications that react to who you are, what actions you take on the page and a myriad of other factors. That's just not possible with static HTML.

tsukikage 9y ago
I have a whole separate rant about HTML5+CSS and Turing completeness, but responding with that here would make me part of the problem. In all seriousness, we need waaay fewer layers of dynamic abstraction than actually get employed to solve most problems.
- nkkollaw 9y ago
  If tools are used incorrectly, it's a problem. But don't say that static HTML was better or would be better, because it simply wouldn't on a high percentage of websites.
king_magic 9y ago
I fundamentally disagree. I don’t think ‘people’ really do want that. That reminds me of the thinking during the 90’s and early 00’s that everyone somehow must want 10 browser toolbars that spam them with ads all the time.
- nkkollaw 9y ago
  Obviously, it depends on the site. However, when you're on YouTube you don't want the site to suggest videos you're not interested in (or Amazon, products). When you're on a blog, you don't want "related articles" to list articles you've already read. Etc. Etc. I don't know if people want this--in part because they don't even realize these features exist--but I'm sure the opposite can be annoying. It also depends how modern techniques are used, but arguining that we have to go back to static HTML because it's better doesn't make sense to me.
  - oedenfield 9y ago
    As a user of both YouTube and Amazon.com I really don't want either recommendations you mentioned. I go to YouTube to watch specific videos and I go to Amazon to buy specific things. Those organizations want to give me recommendations but if I could turn them off and gain performance I would do that in a heartbeat.
    - nkkollaw 9y ago
      Ah, I see. I discover awesome things on both platforms this way. On the performance side, Hacker News still takes 100MB of memory in Chrome, so...
  - tluyben2 9y ago
    You cannot create an efficient static page with recommends below a video? (clientside that is; serverside it would be dynamic but Chrome should not be bothered, it is, but that is another story)
    - nkkollaw 9y ago
      A slow one, yes.
- Reedx 9y ago
  Well, that wasn't really about what they thought people wanted, it was about what toolbar makers thought could get away with (or trick people into). They wanted everyone to use their toolbar filled with ads. And some unsophisticated users ended up installing 10 different toolbars. An example from the late 90s might be the idea that people wanted intro animations and music on web sites, heh.

tsukikage 9y ago

I have a whole separate rant about HTML5+CSS and Turing completeness, but responding with that here would make me part of the problem. In all seriousness, we need waaay fewer layers of dynamic abstraction than actually get employed to solve most problems.

nkkollaw 9y ago
If tools are used incorrectly, it's a problem. But don't say that static HTML was better or would be better, because it simply wouldn't on a high percentage of websites.

king_magic 9y ago

I fundamentally disagree. I don’t think ‘people’ really do want that. That reminds me of the thinking during the 90’s and early 00’s that everyone somehow must want 10 browser toolbars that spam them with ads all the time.

nkkollaw 9y ago
Obviously, it depends on the site. However, when you're on YouTube you don't want the site to suggest videos you're not interested in (or Amazon, products). When you're on a blog, you don't want "related articles" to list articles you've already read. Etc. Etc. I don't know if people want this--in part because they don't even realize these features exist--but I'm sure the opposite can be annoying. It also depends how modern techniques are used, but arguining that we have to go back to static HTML because it's better doesn't make sense to me.
- oedenfield 9y ago
  As a user of both YouTube and Amazon.com I really don't want either recommendations you mentioned. I go to YouTube to watch specific videos and I go to Amazon to buy specific things. Those organizations want to give me recommendations but if I could turn them off and gain performance I would do that in a heartbeat.
  - nkkollaw 9y ago
    Ah, I see. I discover awesome things on both platforms this way. On the performance side, Hacker News still takes 100MB of memory in Chrome, so...
- tluyben2 9y ago
  You cannot create an efficient static page with recommends below a video? (clientside that is; serverside it would be dynamic but Chrome should not be bothered, it is, but that is another story)
  - nkkollaw 9y ago
    A slow one, yes.
Reedx 9y ago
Well, that wasn't really about what they thought people wanted, it was about what toolbar makers thought could get away with (or trick people into). They wanted everyone to use their toolbar filled with ads. And some unsophisticated users ended up installing 10 different toolbars. An example from the late 90s might be the idea that people wanted intro animations and music on web sites, heh.