3 ms·

Hi, DubiousPusher. If you could tell me some other classical music that you really like, I could probably better suggest particular Bach recordings you might li

by Bud 9y ago

Hi, DubiousPusher. If you could tell me some other classical music that you really like, I could probably better suggest particular Bach recordings you might like. I suggest the vocal music, though, for starters.

ken 9y ago
I'm not the same person, but I feel similarly -- though I come from a classical family. My preferences run to Mahler, Tchaikovsky, Dvorak, Brahms, and Wagner. Classical music generally got better as time went on. I mentally group Bach with other 'early music', and as with any art form, I recognize that the early steps were historically significant, but that's about it. I can appreciate the importance of the silent film era, too, even though I'll probably never sit down and watch one for fun. With Bach in particular, how to put it... When making sound into music, there's all these possible axes upon which to add entropy to make it enjoyable: pitch, rhythm, tempo, dynamics, instrumentation, lyrics, and so on. Most of the Bach that I've heard or played is essentially a study in what happens if you fix the value of every axis except "pitch". I assume that different people hear music differently, and for me, I find pitch to be one of the least interesting ways to make a piece of music. (Full disclosure: I play in an all-percussion ensemble, and I probably own more than a couple all-percussion albums.) The prelude to Bach's first cello suite is a neat study in what you can do with a single voice playing 16th notes for 2 minutes -- perhaps even the most interesting possible such line -- but it's still 2 minutes of 16th notes. Time (rhythm/tempo) and space (instrument/position) just feel so much more substantial to me than pitch. I’ve got act 2 of "Die Walküre" playing right now. Which Bach piece is closest to that? :-) I went to a performance of the St Matthew Passion (mentioned elsewhere in this thread) back in college, and my recollection is that the performers did a good job but the piece was nothing special.
- palimpsests 9y ago
  That's why, when I perform Bach's cello suite, I change the rhythms, sometimes quite a bit. I see it as a great sketch in melody and harmony, a springboard to experiment with some more rhythmically sophisticated ideas. It's so fascinating to me that we've fallen under the very real illusion in these modern times that "classical" music has virtually no concept of improvisation, that most of the primary elements of music are completely fixed, static, dead. That's definitely not how it used to be.
  - ken 9y ago
    It's true that in my years taking cello lessons, improvisation never came up. That might help, but I'm not convinced that it's a complete explanation for the disconnect between me and Johann. I confess I don't know the rules of baroque improvisation, but the links posted in other comments here seem to be faithful to the score (at least, for the ones I'm familiar with), yet the commenters seem skeptical anyone could dislike these recordings.
  - imcoconut 9y ago
    It's interesting that you point that out. I remember reading that in his day Bach was widely renowned at improvisation.

by Bud 9y ago

ken 9y ago

I'm not the same person, but I feel similarly -- though I come from a classical family. My preferences run to Mahler, Tchaikovsky, Dvorak, Brahms, and Wagner. Classical music generally got better as time went on. I mentally group Bach with other 'early music', and as with any art form, I recognize that the early steps were historically significant, but that's about it. I can appreciate the importance of the silent film era, too, even though I'll probably never sit down and watch one for fun. With Bach in particular, how to put it... When making sound into music, there's all these possible axes upon which to add entropy to make it enjoyable: pitch, rhythm, tempo, dynamics, instrumentation, lyrics, and so on. Most of the Bach that I've heard or played is essentially a study in what happens if you fix the value of every axis except "pitch". I assume that different people hear music differently, and for me, I find pitch to be one of the least interesting ways to make a piece of music. (Full disclosure: I play in an all-percussion ensemble, and I probably own more than a couple all-percussion albums.) The prelude to Bach's first cello suite is a neat study in what you can do with a single voice playing 16th notes for 2 minutes -- perhaps even the most interesting possible such line -- but it's still 2 minutes of 16th notes. Time (rhythm/tempo) and space (instrument/position) just feel so much more substantial to me than pitch. I’ve got act 2 of "Die Walküre" playing right now. Which Bach piece is closest to that? :-) I went to a performance of the St Matthew Passion (mentioned elsewhere in this thread) back in college, and my recollection is that the performers did a good job but the piece was nothing special.

palimpsests 9y ago
That's why, when I perform Bach's cello suite, I change the rhythms, sometimes quite a bit. I see it as a great sketch in melody and harmony, a springboard to experiment with some more rhythmically sophisticated ideas. It's so fascinating to me that we've fallen under the very real illusion in these modern times that "classical" music has virtually no concept of improvisation, that most of the primary elements of music are completely fixed, static, dead. That's definitely not how it used to be.
- ken 9y ago
  It's true that in my years taking cello lessons, improvisation never came up. That might help, but I'm not convinced that it's a complete explanation for the disconnect between me and Johann. I confess I don't know the rules of baroque improvisation, but the links posted in other comments here seem to be faithful to the score (at least, for the ones I'm familiar with), yet the commenters seem skeptical anyone could dislike these recordings.
- imcoconut 9y ago
  It's interesting that you point that out. I remember reading that in his day Bach was widely renowned at improvisation.