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SSNs aren't supposed to be used for identification. That said the Social Security Administration does have a site that allows for validating SSNs. It appears to

SSNs aren't supposed to be used for identification. That said the Social Security Administration does have a site that allows for validating SSNs. It appears to be geared toward employers verifying SSNs for employment (and therefor tax purposes), the terms may preclude using it for credit reporting purposes. https://www.ssa.gov/employer/ssnv.htm https://www.ssa.gov/employer/ssnv.htm The root problem here is that they're using a public number which was never designed for identification purposes and has no security. The solution would be a national ID, or expansion of the US Passport with in-built security measures. Although that goes over like a lead balloon whenever it's brought up.

conanbatt 9y ago
> Although that goes over like a lead balloon whenever it's brought up. Coming with a country that has a national ID, the US issue with it always caused me laughter. But on the other hand, identification by the state is one of the highest forms of privacy. Its pretty incredible the US has managed to be without that.
- reaperducer 9y ago
  Do you also laugh at the EU's "right to be forgotten" legislation?
  - conanbatt 9y ago
    I think its trying to stop sunlight with your hands.
    - toomuchtodo 9y ago
      Technology is the servant of society, not the other way around. The sky is not falling because the tech industry is finally being reined in. [+] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16531817 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16531817 | [+] http://locusmag.com/2018/03/cory-doctorow-lets-get-better-at-demanding-better-from-tech/ http://locusmag.com/2018/03/cory-doctorow-lets-get-better-at...
      - conanbatt 9y ago
        Wouldn't the analogy be that we are the servants to the state, as the state tells you what you can or can't do?
        toomuchtodo 9y ago
        No, because we have the right to vote, making the state the servant to us. Whether we have properly executed that responsibility is clearly a discussion for a different thread.
        conanbatt 9y ago
        You have the right not to use online services...the right to vote is not a declaration of submission. Particularly when you voted against and a measure was still infringed upon you.
        deleted 9y ago
        [deleted]
- maxerickson 9y ago
  In practice, more than 90% of US adults have a state issued photo id: http://www.projectvote.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/AMERICANS-WITH-PHOTO-ID-Research-Memo-February-2015.pdf http://www.projectvote.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/AMERIC... And not having one often puts people at a disadvantage. So it's a little fuzzier than managing to be without them.
toomuchtodo 9y ago
So only issue credit cards to people with a passport, and give them a statement credit to cover the application fee (premium annual fee cards already cover the cost of precheck/global entry, this isn't a stretch). It's even possible the finance industry could negotiate with the US government a lower rate for passports at scale, thereby turning it into a defacto national ID system. This is just finance industry whining that their system sucks and they want to offload the costs onto the government to manage the fraud. EDIT: "In January, Accenture PLC listed synthetic-identity fraud as one of the biggest threats facing banks in 2018, saying it would be “costing banks billions of dollars and countless hours as they chase down people who don’t even exist.” That pays for a lot of passports! Disclaimer: Am in finance industry, but not credit issuance.
- TehCorwiz 9y ago
  I don't actually have a problem with that as a solution to using a stronger ID. I still think it would need to be coupled with an additional security token or key on the passport side to complete the security, but that's a relatively simple change versus implementing a new ID system from scratch. Although I don't think they're trying to pass the cost to the government. By calling it "identity theft" instead of what it is, fraud, they're trying to pass the cost of fraud to the consumer.
  - toomuchtodo 9y ago
    Login.gov [1], a USDS project, supports the additional auth requirement you desire. Agree with the rest of your comment. [1] https://login.gov/ https://login.gov/
    - TehCorwiz 9y ago
      I'll have to check that out. Thanks. :)
- lg 9y ago
  there are various legal reasons (e.g. parole) why you might be denied a passport that have nothing to do with whether credit should be extended to you.
DINKDINK 9y ago
>The root problem here is that they're using a public number which was never designed for identification purposes and has no security. The solution would be a national ID, or expansion of the US Passport with in-built security measures. No identifier can ever be used as method to express authorization. This is not a matter of security design.

conanbatt 9y ago

> Although that goes over like a lead balloon whenever it's brought up. Coming with a country that has a national ID, the US issue with it always caused me laughter. But on the other hand, identification by the state is one of the highest forms of privacy. Its pretty incredible the US has managed to be without that.

reaperducer 9y ago
Do you also laugh at the EU's "right to be forgotten" legislation?
- conanbatt 9y ago
  I think its trying to stop sunlight with your hands.
  - toomuchtodo 9y ago
    Technology is the servant of society, not the other way around. The sky is not falling because the tech industry is finally being reined in. [+] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16531817 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16531817 | [+] http://locusmag.com/2018/03/cory-doctorow-lets-get-better-at-demanding-better-from-tech/ http://locusmag.com/2018/03/cory-doctorow-lets-get-better-at...
    - conanbatt 9y ago
      Wouldn't the analogy be that we are the servants to the state, as the state tells you what you can or can't do?
      - toomuchtodo 9y ago
        No, because we have the right to vote, making the state the servant to us. Whether we have properly executed that responsibility is clearly a discussion for a different thread.
        conanbatt 9y ago
        You have the right not to use online services...the right to vote is not a declaration of submission. Particularly when you voted against and a measure was still infringed upon you.
        deleted 9y ago
        [deleted]
maxerickson 9y ago
In practice, more than 90% of US adults have a state issued photo id: http://www.projectvote.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/AMERICANS-WITH-PHOTO-ID-Research-Memo-February-2015.pdf http://www.projectvote.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/AMERIC... And not having one often puts people at a disadvantage. So it's a little fuzzier than managing to be without them.

toomuchtodo 9y ago

So only issue credit cards to people with a passport, and give them a statement credit to cover the application fee (premium annual fee cards already cover the cost of precheck/global entry, this isn't a stretch). It's even possible the finance industry could negotiate with the US government a lower rate for passports at scale, thereby turning it into a defacto national ID system. This is just finance industry whining that their system sucks and they want to offload the costs onto the government to manage the fraud. EDIT: "In January, Accenture PLC listed synthetic-identity fraud as one of the biggest threats facing banks in 2018, saying it would be “costing banks billions of dollars and countless hours as they chase down people who don’t even exist.” That pays for a lot of passports! Disclaimer: Am in finance industry, but not credit issuance.

TehCorwiz 9y ago
I don't actually have a problem with that as a solution to using a stronger ID. I still think it would need to be coupled with an additional security token or key on the passport side to complete the security, but that's a relatively simple change versus implementing a new ID system from scratch. Although I don't think they're trying to pass the cost to the government. By calling it "identity theft" instead of what it is, fraud, they're trying to pass the cost of fraud to the consumer.
- toomuchtodo 9y ago
  Login.gov [1], a USDS project, supports the additional auth requirement you desire. Agree with the rest of your comment. [1] https://login.gov/ https://login.gov/
  - TehCorwiz 9y ago
    I'll have to check that out. Thanks. :)
lg 9y ago
there are various legal reasons (e.g. parole) why you might be denied a passport that have nothing to do with whether credit should be extended to you.

DINKDINK 9y ago

>The root problem here is that they're using a public number which was never designed for identification purposes and has no security. The solution would be a national ID, or expansion of the US Passport with in-built security measures. No identifier can ever be used as method to express authorization. This is not a matter of security design.