4 ms·

Boxee's thoughts about the Apple TV

24 points by mike-cardwell 16y ago

retroafroman 16y ago
I agree-freedom is worth the $100.
blehn 16y ago
On a tangent, I'm glad Apple went with a matte black case for the Apple TV. Hopefully that will help kill the highly absurd Piano Black trend.
- dagw 16y ago
  Dear god yes. Buying a new TV recently was a right pain since basically everybody insist on making them as ugly as possible with the most horrendous shiny plastic they can find.
jgv 16y ago
It's great that there will be a serious competitor with Apple TV from the very start. Very much looking forward to the Boxee Box.
- PanMan 16y ago
  I really hope it will be a serious competitor. One is half the price of the other, and will be on sale on every other streetcorner. The other is twice as expensive, doesn't have Apple's sexiness (at least in mindshare), and will be on sale in way less places (or only online). And it won't integrate as seamless with your other iDevices. As much as I like boxee, this will be a tough battle for them.
- jon_dahl 16y ago
  Haven't used it, but I think the Roku box is a serious competitor as well, and already exists. Netflix and other channels, plus a SDK.
hack_edu 16y ago
I hereby declare the new AppleTV the 'iPod TV.' Another device in which Apple's anti-Flash stance keeps me from pressing the 'Buy now' button. These days, video = streaming and like it or not, a large portion of streaming video that streams through the web is one over Flash. This won't change anytime soon. I hate having to fire up my desktop to watch streams for sports or recent TV episodes on the network's homepage. I think about it, and I would have gladly paid apple twice as much for such a device but doubt I'd shell out as much for a dedicated Boxee device.
- stevejohnson 16y ago
  By this argument, Netflix apps should also play Flash because Netflix "does streaming." How the hell do you expect them to deal with the controls on flash movies that explicitly expect a point/click device rather than a remote control? There is no good reason to arbitrarily add Flash support to a set top box that doesn't even have a web browser in the first place. The Apple TV has nothing to do with Flash or any anti-Flash stance.
jasonlbaptiste 16y ago
The amount of opportunity here is mind blowing. Someone needs to do something even more wild with XBMC than Boxee. If I had Fk you money or funding, you have no idea what I would build.
dennykmiu 16y ago
One of the mysteries with today's Apple TV announcement is why they didn't incorporate Apps Store (which is very obvious given that ATV2 nows runs on the A4 processor and IOS4). My guess is that Apple is saving its dry powder (to compete with Google TV). I am convinced that when Apps Store become available, Boxee would be a fantastic app (and as such, would benefit from Apple as opposed to competing with Apple). On the other hand, Boxee Box is a piece of hardware and would be a direct competitor and a strategic mistake (which explains why D-Link is dragging its feet).
- maxawaytoolong 16y ago
  One of the mysteries with today's Apple TV announcement is why they didn't incorporate Apps Store There wouldn't be any apps. When they do this, they will do it like they did with part of the iPad... secret seeding to top devs they want to have in the store at launch. Right now iOS devs are all still recovering from having to crank out their iPad apps in a short amount of time. Personally I am thankful they have given us a break!
  - dennykmiu 16y ago
    I agree with your comment. But this is a matter of timing. I have to believe that within 12 months, they will incorporate apps in the new Apple TV. For a family of four, I spend close to $150 per month on cell phones. Apple is now getting a piece of that and I am happy they do because cell phones used to suck until they came along. I am also spending close to $100 per month on cable and I can't wait until Apple gets a piece of that as well. Nothing sucks more than Comcast Cable. That's a lot of money per month for apps. Go west, young man, go after the money.
    - erqergwerg 16y ago
      Stupid cash cow
- umjames 16y ago
  One thing that's being overlooked: What kind of apps can Apple tout (and we write) when the remote is the only input device? People said they didn't want another computer, so forget wireless keyboards and mice. Maybe a touch interface with the iPad mirroring the TV? You touch the iPad and the results display on both the iPad and the TV, but that would require you to own another device just to use it to its fullest potential. When these problems can be reasonably solved, we'll probably have an app store for the TV.
RBr 16y ago
I think that this comes down to pirating and p0rn. It is very easy for me to download a TV show automatically using TED, have them automatically identified and queued up in Boxee to watch on my TV. I have an old computer connected to my TV via HDMI and a Harmony 880 remote to control it. Beyond television and movie downloads, what about mature content? Apple has gone to great lengths to ensure that the content they offer is free of adult content. I like that but I know that a TV and Internet connected device like this will do a lot better if it's easy to put p0rn on. The problem with the existing Apple TV was the content - short of a price reduction, I didn't see Steve announce any real content changes. In my mind, the biggest thing standing in Boxee's way is their relationship with DLink to price ($200 - $250) and provide the Boxee boxes. I get that they view the boxes as a way to get their primary product (software) in-front of more people, but I think that they'd be wise to diversify with a number of manufacturers making open hardware that comes with Boxee pre-installed.
timmaah 16y ago
What is Boxee and how does it improve upon the media streamers that are out there already? My year old $100 Asus O!Play is awesome.. It handles all my dvd rips and anything I download. There is soo much that could be done with it, Asus just forgot about it or dropped the ball.
- mike-cardwell 16y ago
  http://www.boxee.tv/faq http://www.boxee.tv/faq
patrickk 16y ago
I believe that the new Apple TV won't be a runaway success (and possibly a failure by their standards) for Apple. The reason the iPod was a huge success was because you could fill up that enormous hard drive with music you didn't pay for. What would be the point of owning a piece of hardware you paid hundreds for if you now had to pay hundreds or thousands more to fill it with music? Of course some do, but they are in the minority. People have no problem paying for an expensive-looking piece of hardware they can hold in their hand but balk at the thought of paying a lot for digital content they can only access temporarily (especially when said digital content could be downloaded free elsewhere). I think this is the elephant in the room that Apple have overlooked. If the Apple TV did everything the new model did but had a 1TB drive attached, it would be a different story.
- mjallday 16y ago
  You can still stream movies from your PC or iPod/Phone so the ability to have a hard drive with content you didn't pay for is still there. http://www.apple.com/appletv/#remote http://www.apple.com/appletv/#remote Not sure if it's limited to MP4 or not but I'm sure there will be a way around that.
  - Fluxx 16y ago
    I'm pretty sure it's limited to H.264 and MP4, at least that's what Apple is saying on the tech specs page under "video formats." http://www.apple.com/appletv/specs.html http://www.apple.com/appletv/specs.html I still don't like the idea of having iTunes on a PC be necessary for me to play my video files. What if iTunes doesn't recognize certain file formats that I want to play? I'm SOL. I really like the AppleTV and will buy one, but it's not a media player in the same sense that XBMC or any of its decedents are. It's a player for the userbase who doesn't want to deal with storage, file formats or torrents. That's not me, but it is certainly a large # of people.
absconditus 16y ago
"The Boxee Box is going to be $100 more expensive than the Apple TV, but will give you the freedom to watch what you want." What if I want to watch movies from the major studios? Netflix?
- absconditus 16y ago
  I want to add that I really am not familiar with Boxee. I watched their introduction video and it appears that it does support Netflix. It is not clear where the movies from the major studios are obtained. Do people just rip DVDs and pirate them or is there some other source?
- Nycto 16y ago
  I don't use boxee (yet. I'm going to pick up a boxee box when they come out), but they appear to support Netflix: http://boxee.zendesk.com/entries/86465-the-netflix-app http://boxee.zendesk.com/entries/86465-the-netflix-app
- jonmc12 16y ago
  Netflix works great on Boxee (and Plex). Hulu blocked boxee, but there are still other apps that provide the same shows. List of apps: http://boxee.zendesk.com/entries/193322-boxee-apps http://boxee.zendesk.com/entries/193322-boxee-apps
- w1ntermute 16y ago
  That's not very convincing coming from them. They said that they're huge Apple fanboys, which means they're willing to sacrifice technological freedom themselves for other types of gadgets. Why is freedom so important for an HTPC-like device, but not for other devices?
papa 16y ago
Sounds like an interesting product, but the oddly shaped case seems to reinforce the fact that this will be a niche product: http://www.boxee.tv/box http://www.boxee.tv/box Might seem like a shallow/trivial thing, but I don't really want that thing atop my pile of a/v components.
jsz0 16y ago
Aren't serious IPTV fanatics going to continue using HTPCs? I don't see the Boxee set top really being an adequate solution. It's very limited compared to a $300-$500 HTPC. That puts them into a bad spot of being too expensive and too limited. I think Roku and Apple have the right idea.

24 points by mike-cardwell 16y ago

I agree-freedom is worth the $100.

blehn 16y ago

On a tangent, I'm glad Apple went with a matte black case for the Apple TV. Hopefully that will help kill the highly absurd Piano Black trend.

dagw 16y ago
Dear god yes. Buying a new TV recently was a right pain since basically everybody insist on making them as ugly as possible with the most horrendous shiny plastic they can find.

jgv 16y ago

It's great that there will be a serious competitor with Apple TV from the very start. Very much looking forward to the Boxee Box.

PanMan 16y ago
I really hope it will be a serious competitor. One is half the price of the other, and will be on sale on every other streetcorner. The other is twice as expensive, doesn't have Apple's sexiness (at least in mindshare), and will be on sale in way less places (or only online). And it won't integrate as seamless with your other iDevices. As much as I like boxee, this will be a tough battle for them.
jon_dahl 16y ago
Haven't used it, but I think the Roku box is a serious competitor as well, and already exists. Netflix and other channels, plus a SDK.

hack_edu 16y ago

I hereby declare the new AppleTV the 'iPod TV.' Another device in which Apple's anti-Flash stance keeps me from pressing the 'Buy now' button. These days, video = streaming and like it or not, a large portion of streaming video that streams through the web is one over Flash. This won't change anytime soon. I hate having to fire up my desktop to watch streams for sports or recent TV episodes on the network's homepage. I think about it, and I would have gladly paid apple twice as much for such a device but doubt I'd shell out as much for a dedicated Boxee device.

stevejohnson 16y ago
By this argument, Netflix apps should also play Flash because Netflix "does streaming." How the hell do you expect them to deal with the controls on flash movies that explicitly expect a point/click device rather than a remote control? There is no good reason to arbitrarily add Flash support to a set top box that doesn't even have a web browser in the first place. The Apple TV has nothing to do with Flash or any anti-Flash stance.

jasonlbaptiste 16y ago

The amount of opportunity here is mind blowing. Someone needs to do something even more wild with XBMC than Boxee. If I had Fk you money or funding, you have no idea what I would build.

dennykmiu 16y ago

One of the mysteries with today's Apple TV announcement is why they didn't incorporate Apps Store (which is very obvious given that ATV2 nows runs on the A4 processor and IOS4). My guess is that Apple is saving its dry powder (to compete with Google TV). I am convinced that when Apps Store become available, Boxee would be a fantastic app (and as such, would benefit from Apple as opposed to competing with Apple). On the other hand, Boxee Box is a piece of hardware and would be a direct competitor and a strategic mistake (which explains why D-Link is dragging its feet).

maxawaytoolong 16y ago
One of the mysteries with today's Apple TV announcement is why they didn't incorporate Apps Store There wouldn't be any apps. When they do this, they will do it like they did with part of the iPad... secret seeding to top devs they want to have in the store at launch. Right now iOS devs are all still recovering from having to crank out their iPad apps in a short amount of time. Personally I am thankful they have given us a break!
- dennykmiu 16y ago
  I agree with your comment. But this is a matter of timing. I have to believe that within 12 months, they will incorporate apps in the new Apple TV. For a family of four, I spend close to $150 per month on cell phones. Apple is now getting a piece of that and I am happy they do because cell phones used to suck until they came along. I am also spending close to $100 per month on cable and I can't wait until Apple gets a piece of that as well. Nothing sucks more than Comcast Cable. That's a lot of money per month for apps. Go west, young man, go after the money.
  - erqergwerg 16y ago
    Stupid cash cow
umjames 16y ago
One thing that's being overlooked: What kind of apps can Apple tout (and we write) when the remote is the only input device? People said they didn't want another computer, so forget wireless keyboards and mice. Maybe a touch interface with the iPad mirroring the TV? You touch the iPad and the results display on both the iPad and the TV, but that would require you to own another device just to use it to its fullest potential. When these problems can be reasonably solved, we'll probably have an app store for the TV.

RBr 16y ago

I think that this comes down to pirating and p0rn. It is very easy for me to download a TV show automatically using TED, have them automatically identified and queued up in Boxee to watch on my TV. I have an old computer connected to my TV via HDMI and a Harmony 880 remote to control it. Beyond television and movie downloads, what about mature content? Apple has gone to great lengths to ensure that the content they offer is free of adult content. I like that but I know that a TV and Internet connected device like this will do a lot better if it's easy to put p0rn on. The problem with the existing Apple TV was the content - short of a price reduction, I didn't see Steve announce any real content changes. In my mind, the biggest thing standing in Boxee's way is their relationship with DLink to price ($200 - $250) and provide the Boxee boxes. I get that they view the boxes as a way to get their primary product (software) in-front of more people, but I think that they'd be wise to diversify with a number of manufacturers making open hardware that comes with Boxee pre-installed.

timmaah 16y ago

What is Boxee and how does it improve upon the media streamers that are out there already? My year old $100 Asus O!Play is awesome.. It handles all my dvd rips and anything I download. There is soo much that could be done with it, Asus just forgot about it or dropped the ball.

mike-cardwell 16y ago
http://www.boxee.tv/faq http://www.boxee.tv/faq

patrickk 16y ago

I believe that the new Apple TV won't be a runaway success (and possibly a failure by their standards) for Apple. The reason the iPod was a huge success was because you could fill up that enormous hard drive with music you didn't pay for. What would be the point of owning a piece of hardware you paid hundreds for if you now had to pay hundreds or thousands more to fill it with music? Of course some do, but they are in the minority. People have no problem paying for an expensive-looking piece of hardware they can hold in their hand but balk at the thought of paying a lot for digital content they can only access temporarily (especially when said digital content could be downloaded free elsewhere). I think this is the elephant in the room that Apple have overlooked. If the Apple TV did everything the new model did but had a 1TB drive attached, it would be a different story.

mjallday 16y ago
You can still stream movies from your PC or iPod/Phone so the ability to have a hard drive with content you didn't pay for is still there. http://www.apple.com/appletv/#remote http://www.apple.com/appletv/#remote Not sure if it's limited to MP4 or not but I'm sure there will be a way around that.
- Fluxx 16y ago
  I'm pretty sure it's limited to H.264 and MP4, at least that's what Apple is saying on the tech specs page under "video formats." http://www.apple.com/appletv/specs.html http://www.apple.com/appletv/specs.html I still don't like the idea of having iTunes on a PC be necessary for me to play my video files. What if iTunes doesn't recognize certain file formats that I want to play? I'm SOL. I really like the AppleTV and will buy one, but it's not a media player in the same sense that XBMC or any of its decedents are. It's a player for the userbase who doesn't want to deal with storage, file formats or torrents. That's not me, but it is certainly a large # of people.

absconditus 16y ago

"The Boxee Box is going to be $100 more expensive than the Apple TV, but will give you the freedom to watch what you want." What if I want to watch movies from the major studios? Netflix?

absconditus 16y ago
I want to add that I really am not familiar with Boxee. I watched their introduction video and it appears that it does support Netflix. It is not clear where the movies from the major studios are obtained. Do people just rip DVDs and pirate them or is there some other source?
Nycto 16y ago
I don't use boxee (yet. I'm going to pick up a boxee box when they come out), but they appear to support Netflix: http://boxee.zendesk.com/entries/86465-the-netflix-app http://boxee.zendesk.com/entries/86465-the-netflix-app
jonmc12 16y ago
Netflix works great on Boxee (and Plex). Hulu blocked boxee, but there are still other apps that provide the same shows. List of apps: http://boxee.zendesk.com/entries/193322-boxee-apps http://boxee.zendesk.com/entries/193322-boxee-apps
w1ntermute 16y ago
That's not very convincing coming from them. They said that they're huge Apple fanboys, which means they're willing to sacrifice technological freedom themselves for other types of gadgets. Why is freedom so important for an HTPC-like device, but not for other devices?

papa 16y ago

Sounds like an interesting product, but the oddly shaped case seems to reinforce the fact that this will be a niche product: http://www.boxee.tv/box http://www.boxee.tv/box Might seem like a shallow/trivial thing, but I don't really want that thing atop my pile of a/v components.

jsz0 16y ago

Aren't serious IPTV fanatics going to continue using HTPCs? I don't see the Boxee set top really being an adequate solution. It's very limited compared to a $300-$500 HTPC. That puts them into a bad spot of being too expensive and too limited. I think Roku and Apple have the right idea.