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This article claims a lot of things and assumes many more. I think "affording" children has never been the primary goal of folks having children. Most folks ar

This article claims a lot of things and assumes many more. I think "affording" children has never been the primary goal of folks having children. Most folks aren't all that good at predicting what it will cost to raise a child or three. Some costs aren't as much with multiple children (used clothing, for example, or sharing rooms makes housing more affordable). Others are higher, such as child care and food costs. Some things are improved if one parent stays home. I think the main thing that drives folks to have smaller or larger families is desire to do so rather than costs themselves. Oddly enough, education can help as well, if you are in a country that thinks it needs more or less children in total. I find it appalling that it is socially unacceptable in many places for the man to stay home while the woman works. If my immigration status didn't depend on my husband working and we were at all keen on having children at all, I'd work while he stayed home with children. I'm not sure jobs are any more satisfying, as it is a difficult thing to compare. Many parts of the world simply didn't allow women the same sort of opportunities as men 100 or 150 years ago. Some didn't 40-50 years ago. I got turned down for a job 20 years ago because "females just couldn't do the work required". We also don't actually need large families any longer, not like we did in the past. Between better infant mortality rates, better survival of giving birth, and birth control, and the financial reasons given earlier, it really isn't as necessary. It's OK to do, but it should be a choice. I think society should have laws allowing maternity and paternity leave and time to tend to the children. This should include a parent staying home... at least until the child is in school and/or mature enough to spend some time alone. In so many places, this is missing. There are opportunity costs if someone has multiple children, though. What chances does a woman have to be CEO if she also wants 5 children in a 10-year time frame? If she takes the proper time off for both her pregnancy and infant care, it becomes difficult. This can be worked around with strong paternal leave policies: After all, once a woman is healed enough to do her job, she doesn't need to be the one staying at home. It also puts the opportunity costs on both sexes.

jeffreyrogers 9y ago
There's some evidence that when women start to out-earn their husbands they divorce at higher rates. Whether biological or social (and probably a bit of both), there is an expectation that men contribute more financially than women do, which explains a lot of why men work more after having children than women do. Plus, women obviously invest more in having children than men do.
- Broken_Hippo 9y ago
  Can you sort that out from simple insecurity about not meeting society's standards from a traditional family? And if that is the case, wouldn't it be more prudent to change education or provide counseling to some couples in that situation? And I have no problem with people getting divorced. Divorce rates are a ridiculous standard to rely on because it is based on moral principles. We make it really easy for people to get married, with little to no education about what a healthy relationship might include. I'd rather folks get divorced while they can be on friendly terms, actually, and I'd happily require them to go through some counseling to learn how to do so afterwards (so long as there is no abuse involved). Women do physically produce the child and most can breastfeed or pump milk. Ideally, strong fraternal leave policies means she can get some support while doing this stuff. Even if the father doesn't live with the mother, he can still help out. After that, there isn't anything the woman does that a man can't do, especially while they are young. It just might take some education. Men do it all the time when the woman dies during childbirth, after all. And honestly, a woman should be up to date with education as well since her information could easily be out of date with current medical standards.
  - jeffreyrogers 9y ago
    > Can you sort that out from simple insecurity about not meeting society's standards from a traditional family? And if that is the case, wouldn't it be more prudent to change education or provide counseling to some couples in that situation? I'm not sure. A large part of it could definitely be that men don't know how to act in such a situation since it's not a family format that society has had to deal with before. The changes you're advocating for are all pretty radical (I don't mean this is a bad way necessarily) and I'd be worried that they may have unintended or unplanned for consequences. I don't think it's a given that men can raise children as well as women can. With regards to divorce. I think it's pretty clear that divorce is harmful when children are involved. The best thing for kids is to have two parents in a healthy marriage. Obviously this isn't always possible, but I think it should be the goal.
    - Broken_Hippo 9y ago

jeffreyrogers 9y ago

There's some evidence that when women start to out-earn their husbands they divorce at higher rates. Whether biological or social (and probably a bit of both), there is an expectation that men contribute more financially than women do, which explains a lot of why men work more after having children than women do. Plus, women obviously invest more in having children than men do.

Broken_Hippo 9y ago
Can you sort that out from simple insecurity about not meeting society's standards from a traditional family? And if that is the case, wouldn't it be more prudent to change education or provide counseling to some couples in that situation? And I have no problem with people getting divorced. Divorce rates are a ridiculous standard to rely on because it is based on moral principles. We make it really easy for people to get married, with little to no education about what a healthy relationship might include. I'd rather folks get divorced while they can be on friendly terms, actually, and I'd happily require them to go through some counseling to learn how to do so afterwards (so long as there is no abuse involved). Women do physically produce the child and most can breastfeed or pump milk. Ideally, strong fraternal leave policies means she can get some support while doing this stuff. Even if the father doesn't live with the mother, he can still help out. After that, there isn't anything the woman does that a man can't do, especially while they are young. It just might take some education. Men do it all the time when the woman dies during childbirth, after all. And honestly, a woman should be up to date with education as well since her information could easily be out of date with current medical standards.
- jeffreyrogers 9y ago
  > Can you sort that out from simple insecurity about not meeting society's standards from a traditional family? And if that is the case, wouldn't it be more prudent to change education or provide counseling to some couples in that situation? I'm not sure. A large part of it could definitely be that men don't know how to act in such a situation since it's not a family format that society has had to deal with before. The changes you're advocating for are all pretty radical (I don't mean this is a bad way necessarily) and I'd be worried that they may have unintended or unplanned for consequences. I don't think it's a given that men can raise children as well as women can. With regards to divorce. I think it's pretty clear that divorce is harmful when children are involved. The best thing for kids is to have two parents in a healthy marriage. Obviously this isn't always possible, but I think it should be the goal.
  - Broken_Hippo 9y ago