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> computer scientist and programmer [...] are not even considered proper engineers here That is plain incorrect. Even though the exact details vary by state, p

• weinzierl 9y ago
  I didn't claim that computer scientists are not allowed to call themselves engineers. I even said that the title software engineer is on the rise. What I said and what I stand by is that in my experience the typical German automotive middle manager still has the words Dipl.-Ing. on his degree certificate and looks down on anyone who hasn't, including computer scientists. And just to make clear where I am coming from, making all this claims: I do have a degree certificate with words Dipl.-Ing. on it and another one with the words Master and Informatics on it, so I know a bit of both worlds. When it comes to the IngG, even there it is not as clearly cut as it seems. The whole history of it is interesting but too involved for a short comment, so I will focus on the wording of the law: The law is very specific about the fact that it permits the title "Ingenieur" only to graduates of technical or natural scientific fields. Computer science, like mathematics, is considered a formal science which is neither technical nor a natural science.
  • kbwt 9y ago
    > Master of Informatics Let me guess, your degree was actually in Computer Science and is "mistranslated" as Informatics by your University? Informatics degrees[1] actually exist in the US and are different from Computer Science degrees[2]. [1] https://ischool.uw.edu/programs/informatics https://ischool.uw.edu/programs/informatics [2] https://www.cs.washington.edu/academics/ugrad/courses/requirements https://www.cs.washington.edu/academics/ugrad/courses/requir...
    • _0ffh 9y ago
      Nah, it's probably just a "false friend" mistranslation (1): "Computer Science" translates as "Informatik" in German. So if you've got a German degree in "Informatik", it's what would be called "Computer Science" in anglophone countries. Ed. (1) by the poster
      • kbwt 9y ago
        My Informatik degree piece of paper has both German and English text, but the English says "Informatics" rather than "Computer Science".
  • kbwt 9y ago
    > The law is very specific about the fact that it permits the title "Ingenieur" only to graduates of technical or natural scientific fields At least in the case of BW, Computer Science is clearly listed as one of the possible fields: "[...] wobei dieses Studium überwiegend von den Bereichen Mathematik, Informatik, Naturwissenschaften und Technik geprägt sein muss [...]"
    • weinzierl 9y ago
      > "[...] wobei dieses Studium überwiegend von den Bereichen Mathematik, Informatik, Naturwissenschaften und Technik geprägt sein muss [...]" "dieses" refers to "Studium in einer technischen oder naturwissenschaftlichen Fachrichtung" which means only technical or natural scientific fields qualify. From my understanding Bioinformatics would qualify, because it could be considered a natural science and the learning content is dominated by topics from the natural sciences, computer science and technology. Pure computer science would not qualify because it is neither a natural science nor technical. It does not qualify because it doesn't satisfy the precondition to the sentence you quoted. I'm not a lawyer and this is just my reading of the law and I didn't find any court decisions or anything regarding this topic.
  • rad_gruchalski 9y ago
    That’s not exactly how it works. You can call yoursef an engineer if you can prove that your past experience is matching the one of a studied engineer. I knwo, I’m going theough that with Finanzamt atm.