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You are assuming that we have few people who would actually enjoy being a janitor or plumber and I can assure you that's wrong. People don't go into those profe
by lobotryas 9y ago
You are assuming that we have few people who would actually enjoy being a janitor or plumber and I can assure you that's wrong. People don't go into those professions because of economic and societal pressures (something you are perpetuating by implying that tue aforementioned are not prestigious or 'good' professions). More over, my point is not that everyone should or would even want to become an artist. It is the fact that many people are not given a balanced choice.
- strken 9y agoFrom an n=2 sample size, both our office cleaners come in after their day jobs because they want to earn a bit of cash on the side. Absent a reward of some kind, it's hard to imagine why anyone would bother cleaning someone else's floor.
- kiriakasis 9y agoAbsent a reward of some kind, it's hard to imagine why anyone would bother working in a lot of jobs
- slfnflctd 9y agoA while back I used to say that I'd rather be a janitor (for offices, anyway) than do tech support for non-technical end users. When I unexpectedly found myself presented with those two options, wouldn't you know it, I chose exactly how I said I would. I was happy with my choice, and if I found myself in the same situation I would make it again.
- jschwartzi 9y agoI'd love to be a janitor. You can clock out after 8 hours of work, and if you don't someone is paying you time and a half. Being a software engineer is a shit job because people expect you to "give it your all" which usually means spending all your time in the office. I'm leaving my current company because they expected me to cancel planned trips, vacations, and time with friends simply because they can't plan anything. And management was openly resentful when I wouldn't. My twenties and thirties are the best years of my life and if you won't let me have them I'll find someone who will.
- daveFNbuck 9y agoYou have a very weird definition of balanced choice. If I were given a choice between working or not and would receive full pay and benefits either way, I'd stop working. As much as I would like to be able to make such a choice, it's not a balanced one. The different pay and benefits are how we balance the choices to reflect not just your individual preferences but the needs of society.
- jakobegger 9y agoI strongly disagree with the idea that pay reflects the needs of our society in any way.
- dozzie 9y ago"Needs" as in "need for entertainment", not "needs" as in "need for shelter". More of a "we want this and thus we're willing to pay for it".
- daveFNbuck 9y agoDo you really feel that society is equally well off whether I get a job or stay home doing nothing all day?
- jakobegger 9y agoI don’t know about you specifically, but I’ve met enough people who would contribute more to society if they just stayed home. I think there is very little correlation between salary and use to society.
- daveFNbuck 9y agoDo you agree that on average, society needs people to work? Do you agree that on average, society needs new software engineers more than it needs new sculptors?
- lobotryas 9y agoYou are misunderstanding my position by assuming that "not working" is anywhere on the table. I believe that if people want to eat and are fully able then they should work. My lament is that the opportunity to choose one's path is not a balanced one. i.e.: I have to optimize for pay, for QOL, or hope for a balance between the two. The latter of course exists, but it's much rarer than "just" a 150k+ SoftEng job in CA.