4 ms·

PGLAF thinks that the German court is wrong. However, they would prefer to not have German court decision - even if they believe it is wrong - against them to b

by smsm42 9y ago

PGLAF thinks that the German court is wrong. However, they would prefer to not have German court decision - even if they believe it is wrong - against them to be in power, since international treaties mean it can have consequences beyond Germany. Thus, they are fighting it in German court. In order to raise chances of winning, they choose not to openly flaunt German court decision - which they can always do later if it turns out resolving it within German justice system is a no go. It is a common thing to do - you can disagree with some decision being legal and still temporary abide by it in order to work within the judicial system and not put yourself outside it.

weinzierl 9y ago
> PGLAF thinks that the German court is wrong. They made that point in their article and they also made clear that this is not just their opinion but also that of their legal teams in the US and Germany. > However, they would prefer to not have German court decision - even if they believe it is wrong - against them to be in power, since international treaties mean it can have consequences beyond Germany. And that is my point. The best way to not have a German court decision would have been not to ask for one. They could have easily avoided the whole situation if they just ignored the lawsuit brought against them in Germany. > Thus, they are fighting it in German court. They are fighting in a German court, even if they could have avoided it, because they would prefer not to have a German court decision? That doesn't make any sense. > In order to raise chances of winning, they choose not to openly flaunt German court decision The way to avoid embarrassment on all sides would have been to ignore the lawsuit and point the publisher to the proper ways to handles this, namely either US court or WIPO. Being ignored by a US organization wouldn't have been a big deal neither for the German court nor the publishers, this happens all the time. I appreciate PGLAF highly, but what they did here just caused unnecessary drama. > - which they can always do later if it turns out resolving it within German justice system is a no go. Which would be the ultimate embarrassment for the German justice system, don't you think? > It is a common thing to do - you can disagree with some decision being legal and still temporary abide by it in order to work within the judicial system and not put yourself outside it. I agree with that, I just think that in this case there was no need for it. PGLAF could have avoided the situation without consequences.
- withoutmalice 9y ago
  > The way to avoid embarrassment on all sides would have been to ignore the lawsuit and point the publisher to the proper ways to handles this, namely either US court or WIPO. They did. See this part of the FAQ: PGLAF already informed Plaintiff and the German Court that the US Court system is the appropriate venue for Plaintiff's concerns. Plaintiff declined. Alternatively, international treaties - notably the Berne Convention and related treaties - provide mediation processes through the World Intellectual Property Organization. PGLAF offered to undergo this mediation process, and Plaintiff declined.
  - weinzierl 9y ago
    The "ignore the lawsuit" is the important part. No one forced them to enter the lawsuit in Germany.
    - wnoise 9y ago
      Ignoring a lawsuit doesn't make the lawsuit go away, it means a default judgement.
- smsm42 9y ago
  > The best way to not have a German court decision would have been not to ask for one. PGLAF didn't. > They could have easily avoided the whole situation if they just ignored the lawsuit brought against them in Germany. That would not have avoided having court decision - that would just lead to the decision be by default, without their argument even being heard and without the court exposing the flimsy base on which the decision stands. They'd have lost not because the argument is bad but because they didn't show up. And you can't appeal not showing up. > They are fighting in a German court, even if they could have avoided it, because they would prefer not to have a German court decision? That doesn't make any sense. I am not sure what gives you trouble here. Imagine you are wrongfully arrested. You would then probably go to court and demand your being released, and compensated, even if you would prefer - and would vigorously claim - that the entire arrest is unlawful and you shouldn't even be here at the first place. Same here. > The way to avoid embarrassment on all sides would have been to ignore the lawsuit Ignoring court decisions rarely works that well, especially in modern globalized world.

by smsm42 9y ago

weinzierl 9y ago

> PGLAF thinks that the German court is wrong. They made that point in their article and they also made clear that this is not just their opinion but also that of their legal teams in the US and Germany. > However, they would prefer to not have German court decision - even if they believe it is wrong - against them to be in power, since international treaties mean it can have consequences beyond Germany. And that is my point. The best way to not have a German court decision would have been not to ask for one. They could have easily avoided the whole situation if they just ignored the lawsuit brought against them in Germany. > Thus, they are fighting it in German court. They are fighting in a German court, even if they could have avoided it, because they would prefer not to have a German court decision? That doesn't make any sense. > In order to raise chances of winning, they choose not to openly flaunt German court decision The way to avoid embarrassment on all sides would have been to ignore the lawsuit and point the publisher to the proper ways to handles this, namely either US court or WIPO. Being ignored by a US organization wouldn't have been a big deal neither for the German court nor the publishers, this happens all the time. I appreciate PGLAF highly, but what they did here just caused unnecessary drama. > - which they can always do later if it turns out resolving it within German justice system is a no go. Which would be the ultimate embarrassment for the German justice system, don't you think? > It is a common thing to do - you can disagree with some decision being legal and still temporary abide by it in order to work within the judicial system and not put yourself outside it. I agree with that, I just think that in this case there was no need for it. PGLAF could have avoided the situation without consequences.

withoutmalice 9y ago
> The way to avoid embarrassment on all sides would have been to ignore the lawsuit and point the publisher to the proper ways to handles this, namely either US court or WIPO. They did. See this part of the FAQ: PGLAF already informed Plaintiff and the German Court that the US Court system is the appropriate venue for Plaintiff's concerns. Plaintiff declined. Alternatively, international treaties - notably the Berne Convention and related treaties - provide mediation processes through the World Intellectual Property Organization. PGLAF offered to undergo this mediation process, and Plaintiff declined.
- weinzierl 9y ago
  The "ignore the lawsuit" is the important part. No one forced them to enter the lawsuit in Germany.
  - wnoise 9y ago
    Ignoring a lawsuit doesn't make the lawsuit go away, it means a default judgement.
smsm42 9y ago
> The best way to not have a German court decision would have been not to ask for one. PGLAF didn't. > They could have easily avoided the whole situation if they just ignored the lawsuit brought against them in Germany. That would not have avoided having court decision - that would just lead to the decision be by default, without their argument even being heard and without the court exposing the flimsy base on which the decision stands. They'd have lost not because the argument is bad but because they didn't show up. And you can't appeal not showing up. > They are fighting in a German court, even if they could have avoided it, because they would prefer not to have a German court decision? That doesn't make any sense. I am not sure what gives you trouble here. Imagine you are wrongfully arrested. You would then probably go to court and demand your being released, and compensated, even if you would prefer - and would vigorously claim - that the entire arrest is unlawful and you shouldn't even be here at the first place. Same here. > The way to avoid embarrassment on all sides would have been to ignore the lawsuit Ignoring court decisions rarely works that well, especially in modern globalized world.