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Can someone in Germany confirm this block is actually in place? In any case, if anyone in Germany would like to access Project Gutenberg, I maintain a full, da
by dsacco 9y ago
Can someone in Germany confirm this block is actually in place?
In any case, if anyone in Germany would like to access Project Gutenberg, I maintain a full, daily updated mirror here: https://mirrors.sorengard.com/gutenberg https://mirrors.sorengard.com/gutenberg. I also support FTP and Rsync if you’d like to download that way.
No donations are asked for, but it would be helpful if more people hosted mirrors for precisely this reason :). Unfortunately this mirror doesn’t have the search capabilities of the Project Gutenberg homepage, but it at least has all the files.
Now I’m actually curious about what is going to happen with Project Gutenberg mirrors. In general, many mirror admins (such as myself) join a project’s mirror mailing list and don’t necessarily pay attention to the right announcements to learn about this kind of legal minutia. That presents something of a logistics problem all around.
Putting aside ethics, it’s likely that many/most downstream mirrors simply won’t block German traffic. Project Gutenberg can stop redirecting German traffic to those mirrors on the fly, but they can’t stop the mirrors from being available unless they start banning mirrors (and mirror syncing traffic) that don’t enforce similar blocks...this seems logistically untenable.
It would be cool if we could get a lawyer to chime in about Project Gutenberg’s liability with respect to forcing other mirrors to comply. For example, I’m making my own mirror available to Germany. Is Project Gutenberg complicit in a meaningful sense, if they allow me to continue mirroring?
- tehlike 9y agoCan anything be made using ipfs?
- deleted 9y ago[deleted]
- deleted 9y ago[deleted]
- mirimir 9y agoCertainly, given that each ebook could be a static hash. But you'd need to revise index pages periodically. And I'm not sure how search could be implemented. Except through Google, which does index pages from https://ipfs.io/ipfs/ https://ipfs.io/ipfs/ . However, I gather that IPFS respects take-down requests, so you might need to use another gateway.
- einrealist 9y agoIsn't IPFS peer to peer? Then it would be no different than using Torrent clients. Users would be just noticed or sued individually.
- thesimon 9y ago>Can someone who is in Germany actually confirm this block is in place? Cannot confirm it, Gutenberg.org works fine for me. Edit: tried 3 different ISPs, no issues. Edit 2: Tried accessing books, this was blocked for 1/3.
- dsacco 9y agoInteresting, thanks. I wonder if the block was more localized then all of Germany, if it was simply misconfigured, or if they just decided to stop blocking the traffic.
- cheschire 9y agoThey only block the books themselves, not the index pages. Attempting to view any book will result in a block message.
- Merem 9y agoWorks fine for me for all books I tested. Can you name some specific ones which are blocked for you?
- freeflight 9y agoI'm on one of the biggest German ISPs (Deutsche Telekom) and I can access front page and books just fine. Tried it with the HTML versions of four different books, among them "most popular" like Alice's Adventures in Wonderland and A Tale of Two Cities, they all work without issue.
- cheschire 9y agoCan confirm it. All books are blocked even though the front page is accessible.
- philippnagel 9y agoWorks fine for me. Seems like the block is not active at the moment. Edit: Individual books are blocked.
- thesimon 9y ago>Edit: Individual books are blocked. Vodafone?
- philippnagel 9y agoDSL from Easybell.
- tdons 9y agoYour IP Address is Blocked from www.gutenberg.org We apologize for this inconvenience. Your IP address has been automatically blocked from the address you tried to visit at www.gutenberg.org. This is because the geoIP database shows your address is in the country of Germany. Diagnostic information: Your IP address: <redacted> Referrer URL (if available): http://www.gutenberg.org/cache/latest-covers http://www.gutenberg.org/cache/latest-covers Time (GMT): Saturday, 03-Mar-2018 21:19:12 GMT Why did this block occur? A Court in Germany ordered that access to certain items in the Project Gutenberg collection are blocked from Germany. Project Gutenberg believes the Court has no jurisdiction over the matter, but until the issue is resolved during appeal, it will comply. For more information about the German court case, visit PGLAF's information page about the German lawsuit. For more information about the legal advice Project Gutenberg has received concerning international issues, visit PGLAF's International Copyright Guidance for Project Gutenberg How can I get unblocked? All IP addresses in Germany are blocked. This block will remain in place until legal guidance changes. If your IP address lookup is incorrect Use the Maxmind GeoIP demo to verify status of your IP address. Project Gutenberg updates its listing of IP addresses approximately monthly.
- abalone 9y ago> A Court in Germany ordered that access to certain items in the Project Gutenberg collection are blocked from Germany... until the issue is resolved during appeal, [Project Gutenberg] will comply. This is really misleading. It implies -- nay, outright states -- that Gutenberg is merely complying with the court order. But the court did not order the entire site to be blocked. A more candid answer is found in their information page:[1] Q: Why block all of Germany, rather than just those 18 books? A: ...Because the German Court has overstepped its jurisdiction, and allowed the world's largest publishing group to bully Project Gutenberg for these 18 books, there is every reason to think that this will keep happening... Blocking Germany, in an effort to forestall further legal actions, seems the best way to protect the organization and retain focus on its mission. [1] https://cand.pglaf.org/germany/index.html https://cand.pglaf.org/germany/index.html
- obastani 9y ago
- netsharc 9y agoBased on how media companies sue German torrent sharers (it's a cash cow for the law firms, like the one that is involved here, Waldorf Frommer), they sue individuals for making copyrighted content available on the internet -- because when you're torrenting something other people can get the completed parts from your computer, so if you run a mirror which is accessible from Germany, you will probably get a letter from the above law firm.
- freeflight 9y ago> if you run a mirror which is accessible from Germany Access from Germany isn't the issue, having a German IP is the issue. They don't go after foreign seeders because that would be too much hassle getting the real data behind the IP (just like German law doesn't apply to them), but they hunt down seeders with German IP's with quite a vengeance.
- mcguire 9y agoPG is a US organization. They may have volunteer mirrors in Germany, but all of PG itself is in San Francisco, right?
- netsharc 9y agoNow we're mixing up 2 issues... torrents of copyrighted content with German seeders, and e-books of copyrighted content (at least copyrighted in Germany) with a website provider. They only go for German seeders because asking a foreign ISP for the address of someone who used a particular IP address at a particular date and time would probably get them the middle finger as a reply. In the case of PG, they know who is making the copyrighted content available in Germany, because PG has an address on their website. And a German court said it's within their jurisdiction. If you run a mirror with your contact information available, presumably they will contact you next.
- iforgotpassword 9y agoYep, they are serious business, not one of the dodgy ones that send out as many threatening letters as possible and hope that a few pay. They'll actually go to court, or did so in the past, with a huge army of lawyers. When the "fliegende gerichtsstand" was abolished they got more selective with which cases they actually took to court, depending on the city they'd have to go to. Before, all cases were handled in Munich, and the judges there were pretty much rubber-stamping the cases in favor of WF.
- rawland 9y agoWorks (Search, lookup, random German authors) fine for me. PS: I'm surfing with (mostly) this configuration: http://12bytes.org/tech/firefox/firefoxgecko-configuration-guide-for-privacy-and-performance-buffs http://12bytes.org/tech/firefox/firefoxgecko-configuration-g... No idea, if this might affect the outcome. IMHO, not.
- chris_engel 9y agoDid you actually open a book? Because everything else is not blocked.
- rawland 9y agoSeveral. HTML versions though. Might be IPv6 as mentioned above. Sad...
- pbalau 9y agoOt: what are the logistics of running a pg mirror, traffic and space wise?
- rapfaria 9y agohttp://www.gutenberg.org/wiki/Gutenberg:Mirroring_How-To http://www.gutenberg.org/wiki/Gutenberg:Mirroring_How-To
- Tomte 9y agoI can still access it. No proxies or VPNs of any kind, just regular Telekom DSL.
- chris_engel 9y agoTry to access a book.
- Tomte 9y agoWorks fine.
- bhaak 9y agoAccording to heise.de, only IPv4 users are affected so far. If you are using IPv6, you are still able to access it.
- YtvwlD 9y agoOh, wow. Yes, it works here with IPv6.
- jhasse 9y agoAlso Telekom DSL, not blocked. edit: Sorry: Only the frontpage isn't, search and books are ...
- elcapitan 9y agoCan confirm block in O2 network, I can visit the homepage but access no books.
- xab9 9y agogeofencing is not perfect.
- ubiyubix 9y agoSame here. No problem accessing it. I am a Telekom customer using IPv6.
- kameit00 9y agoConfirmed. Download pages are blocked. But reachable via non german VPN servers. Seems like money rules the world - sad...
- mirimir 9y agoThanks for the mirror!
- zebraflask 9y agoThey probably blocked some version of Mein Kampf, which they have every right to do and ought to do.
- yetanother1980 9y agoWhy? I hate everything Hitler stood for. I read mein kampf it did not change my opinion.
- deleted 9y ago[deleted]
- mcguire 9y agoThe authors and books are listed in the linked faq. None seem politically related, although I don't know German.
- zebraflask 9y agoRead them in the original. They are not pleasant and bringing up the memory of those things is just as bad as causing them.
- k__ 9y agoI get ERR_SSL_PROTOCOL_ERROR
- err4nt 9y agoHi! Thanks for the service you do for others by mirroring this content - what's involved with being a mirror? I'm not sure if it's something I have the means or skills to do, but Project Gutenberg (and information projects like it) are the key part of the internet — the parts that deserve to be reserved and accessed freely by all. I'd love to see if there's anything I could do to help out!
- dsacco 9y agoIt’s very easy. I host official mirrors for a bunch of open source projects at https://mirrors.sorengard.com https://mirrors.sorengard.com. You set up Apache on a web server you control, configure virtual host settings in the Apache config files, then put your files to be hosted in something like /var/www/ and point Apache to it. Then set up Rsync by running the rsync daemon and setting an /etc/rsyncd.conf file that configures where the files are located and who can access them. For example, let’s say you wanted to set up a mirror for the Ubuntu Package Archive. You could do that step by step with the following resources: 1. https://www.digitalocean.com/community/tutorials/how-to-install-the-apache-web-server-on-ubuntu-16-04 https://www.digitalocean.com/community/tutorials/how-to-inst... 2. https://www.digitalocean.com/community/tutorials/how-to-set-up-apache-virtual-hosts-on-ubuntu-16-04 https://www.digitalocean.com/community/tutorials/how-to-set-... 3. https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Rsyncmirror https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Rsyncmirror Maybe I’ll write up a short guide and throw it up somewhere. It’s really pretty straightforward. FTP is unfortunately trickier than HTTP and Rsync, but vsftpd removes a lot of the warts.
- BlackFingolfin 9y agoYou mirror sage, but your site still links to sage.org, which seems to be defunct AFAICT, current is http://www.sagemath.org http://www.sagemath.org
- drvortex 9y agoThe block is indeed in place, but trivially circumvented using a VPN. Please e careful with your mirror. You are now susceptible to the same lawsuit as the original Project Gutenberg. I am not sure where you are in the world, but Germany has legal assistance treaties with the US/UK/Scandanavia, all EEC and Schengen countries. https://www.congress.gov/treaty-document/108th-congress/27/document-text https://www.congress.gov/treaty-document/108th-congress/27/d... https://www.mlat.info/mlat-index https://www.mlat.info/mlat-index
- mcguire 9y agoI'm not a lawyer, but you may be seeing a cease and desist letter in your near future. BTW, you may want to make sure you aren't keeping logs including traffic sources' IP addresses.
- gsich 9y agoi doubt it.
- Lunatic666 9y agoWouldn’t this be a good use case for IPFS? Then we could share the traffic and don’t have a single point of failure.
- dsacco 9y agoSure, I don’t see why not. How involved is the process of putting the data onto IPFS?
- mseidl 9y agoI'm German and I can access it, and that book all of Mann's other books.
- merb 9y agoI am not blocked. I could've even download "Der Vater" one of the eBooks from the case. And yes german copyright laws are a fucking joke.
- sqldba 9y ago> copyright laws are a fucking joke. Fixed that for you :-)
- expertentipp 9y agoGerman ones are a particularly dark one.
- darklajid 9y agoHow are German ones worse? I always think of Disney and Mosanto when I think about litigious companies..
- yk 9y agoThe German copy right law was quite noticeable written with companies in mind, and had originally a right to private copies to get private people out of the reaches of the law. You could copy an entire book, or a movie, give it to a friend and that would be perfectly legal. (As long as you are clearly not doing that in any kind of commercial fashion.) Early in the last decade, judges ruled that this basically never applies to anything internet, with the result that the entire copyright law is applicable. That would not be a big problem, except the entire law is written with the idea that both parties have already lawyers on staff. One example is the "Abmahnung," the way copy right disputes are meant to be resolved is, the lawyer of anybody who believes their copy right to be infringed sends a letter that tells the other guy to stop that, pay damages and sign a contract to never do that again. The escalation of that is, when you receive such a letter, then you sue against the "Abmahnung" and the judge who hears the case also decides about the original infringement. Trouble is, you are now suing and therefore the court is wherever the people who send the "Abmahnung" in the first place reside -- not a big problem if you are an large company in the first place.
- josteink 9y agoStuff like this makes me want to run a mirror too. If I may ask, how much disk capacity does running a Gutenberg mirror currently take?
- TobiasBales 9y agoI am not using a VPN or anything and can access http://www.gutenberg.org/ http://www.gutenberg.org/ just fine from germany (including access to books). Not sure why though.
- fs111 9y agoI just tried and it was not blocked. maybe the block does not work on IPv6..
- FeepingCreature 9y agoSame here on 1&1.
- Iv 9y agoHow big is the data? I think that is also a good case for hosting this on ZeroNet, the internet as it should be : P2P and decentralized.
- _fizz_buzz_ 9y agoIt still works for me and I can access the content of books. My provider is unitymedia.
- deleted 9y ago[deleted]
- maxzda 9y agoStill works for me