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Interesting. I've discussed this with others on HN previously. Seems this one goes toward confirming my suspicions. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=146051

Interesting. I've discussed this with others on HN previously. Seems this one goes toward confirming my suspicions. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14605111 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14605111 Now the moral dillema of whether or not to continue to use these services or revert back to terribly inconvenient taxi services is really going to nag at me.

verelo 9y ago
Id like to see the same study done to taxi drivers. I suspect the situation is no better if you look at their return on invested time and money. The concern you suspected is the same one I suspected too. In 2015 i did some uber driving for "fun". I quickly realized that it was just a way to extract the net worth of a car, from the car, without selling it. When you think of it that way, i see some significant utility...however Uber doesn't position it to drivers as "get the money stuck in your car, out of your car!" instead they say "earn cash" and stuff like that.
- CoryG89 9y ago
  It would be interesting to see it done with taxi drivers, but they don't typically own the cars they drive, do they? I would have imagined they were all at least making minimum wage after all is said and done.
  - verelo 9y ago
    They’re a super exploited group, often new immigrants too. Many times they “rent” the car, paying a daily fee for the seat, and then get to collect all the income for the day. Many times it means working 7-8 hours before making any returns of their own. It’s your typical “work for yourself” type scam, when really you’re an employee with no acknowledged rights. I have no love of uber or the taxi industry, i guess i just don’t see one as better than the other, and it’s hard to say either is worse. I suspect it is the way it is because consumers don’t want to pay what it would take to really give the drivers minimum wage. I dare say this is an indication that it’s a realistic primary target for early AI automation.
netsharc 9y ago
Maybe the answer is like the waitering ("waiting"?) industry in the USA. They get paid shit and have to rely on tips to get by, so tipping is mandatory. So if you want to have a clean conscience, maybe tip your driver something like 50% the difference between Uber and a taxi, and start a campaign so all ride-share users do this.
- drb91 9y ago
  Yes, more mandatory tipping will make everyone happier.
  - rs999gti 9y ago
    But abolishing tipping would allow restaurants to pay a fair wage: http://www.chicagotribune.com/business/ct-eliminate-tipping-waiters-20151016-story.html http://www.chicagotribune.com/business/ct-eliminate-tipping-...
    - drb91 9y ago
      “Allow” as if mom and pop restaurants will pay more than the minimum legally necessary.
    - netsharc 9y ago
      Uber has no tipping (or does it?) and hence, here we are discussing the findings of this MIT study...
      - paulie_a 9y ago
        Uber does have tipping built in.
chillingeffect 9y ago
> whether or not to continue I think it's possible to continue ethically: Just tip according to the amount the ride costs/ is worth. Using the numbers in this article should help. It seems like paying the amount of the ride in a tip would lead to an ethical amount.

verelo 9y ago

Id like to see the same study done to taxi drivers. I suspect the situation is no better if you look at their return on invested time and money. The concern you suspected is the same one I suspected too. In 2015 i did some uber driving for "fun". I quickly realized that it was just a way to extract the net worth of a car, from the car, without selling it. When you think of it that way, i see some significant utility...however Uber doesn't position it to drivers as "get the money stuck in your car, out of your car!" instead they say "earn cash" and stuff like that.

CoryG89 9y ago
It would be interesting to see it done with taxi drivers, but they don't typically own the cars they drive, do they? I would have imagined they were all at least making minimum wage after all is said and done.
- verelo 9y ago
  They’re a super exploited group, often new immigrants too. Many times they “rent” the car, paying a daily fee for the seat, and then get to collect all the income for the day. Many times it means working 7-8 hours before making any returns of their own. It’s your typical “work for yourself” type scam, when really you’re an employee with no acknowledged rights. I have no love of uber or the taxi industry, i guess i just don’t see one as better than the other, and it’s hard to say either is worse. I suspect it is the way it is because consumers don’t want to pay what it would take to really give the drivers minimum wage. I dare say this is an indication that it’s a realistic primary target for early AI automation.

netsharc 9y ago

Maybe the answer is like the waitering ("waiting"?) industry in the USA. They get paid shit and have to rely on tips to get by, so tipping is mandatory. So if you want to have a clean conscience, maybe tip your driver something like 50% the difference between Uber and a taxi, and start a campaign so all ride-share users do this.

drb91 9y ago
Yes, more mandatory tipping will make everyone happier.
- rs999gti 9y ago
  But abolishing tipping would allow restaurants to pay a fair wage: http://www.chicagotribune.com/business/ct-eliminate-tipping-waiters-20151016-story.html http://www.chicagotribune.com/business/ct-eliminate-tipping-...
  - drb91 9y ago
    “Allow” as if mom and pop restaurants will pay more than the minimum legally necessary.
  - netsharc 9y ago
    Uber has no tipping (or does it?) and hence, here we are discussing the findings of this MIT study...
    - paulie_a 9y ago
      Uber does have tipping built in.

chillingeffect 9y ago

> whether or not to continue I think it's possible to continue ethically: Just tip according to the amount the ride costs/ is worth. Using the numbers in this article should help. It seems like paying the amount of the ride in a tip would lead to an ethical amount.