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Yes that's true, which is why I said "why not both?" The manager should do more, but so should the employee. Sitting there and saying "I'm blocked, woe is me" i

Yes that's true, which is why I said "why not both?" The manager should do more, but so should the employee. Sitting there and saying "I'm blocked, woe is me" is garbage compared to saying "I'm blocked. Can you please help me Mr/Ms XYZ?"

orbitur 9y ago
The employee needs to be taught that. If they've entered the workforce without that knowledge, then it's their manager's responsibility.
epicureanideal 9y ago
I think your specification of a "correct way to report a problem" is company specific, or your personal preference, or the way that you think an ideal problem report would be stated. We're humans. Unless there's been a training day or a Readme file explaining HOW to report a bug, I think it's perfectly reasonable to expect this protocol to work: "I'm blocked!" "Why?" "{reason}" If nobody ACKs the "I'm blocked" message, it's reasonable for someone to think that nobody cares or nobody is listening. This is a normal human protocol, as used in most human environments. "{problem}!" "What's happening? How can I help?" (any considerate person nearby responds)
- mratzloff 9y ago
  "I'm blocked because on compile I get such-and-such error message and I don't know how to fix it. Who is the right person to ask about this?" I just cut your protocol complexity by half. ;-)
  - kirkules 9y ago
    S/he wasn't proposing a protocol, but describing a naturally occurring one.
  - dzamo_norton 9y ago
    Same complexity, just less chatty.
thereare5lights 9y ago
It takes a certain kind of person to interpret ""I'm blocked" as "I'm blocked, woe is me" instead of "I'm blocked. Can anyone that sees this help me?" Those people should never be managers.
- bitcraft 9y ago
  I disagree. A manager should be skeptical to ensure everyone is pulling their weight and being truthful.
  - thegayngler 9y ago
    If they don't trust the employee they need to fire them.
    - bitcraft 9y ago
      I agree with you that employees that you cannot trust should be fired. Skepticism doesn’t necessarily mean lack of trust. It’s possible to trust dishonest people and without a skeptical view to be aware that people may be dishonest, even in small ways, it is easy to fall into that trap of trusting good liars.
pm90 9y ago
You will get a lot of downvotes for making that statement here... but let me just say I agree with you 100%. The people I see that get the most work done aren’t the ones crying publicly for help on a nebulous problem, but asking very specific questions about specific problems. In cases one doesn’t make progress, escalate to the manager giving details about exactly what is going on, how many times you reached out to another team and got no answers. That gives the manager ammunition to talk to their peers on other teams or escalate to higher ups. It’s rather unrealistic for the manager to be understanding all the time and coax a team member to give all details of every problem...
- JBlue42 9y ago
  That's how I was taught (via managers on reddit actually, not irl). Dig as far as you can, record it all, then escalate. You also have to gauge how critical it is and how much of your time (esp. if other things are building up) to spend on it as a factor of when to take it up the line. Tbh, I haven't had any managers lately that have been that great but I'm still holding out hope.
TheSpiceIsLife 9y ago
> What a complete lack of individual ownership. Even the best manager can't help somebody who is unwilling to help themselves. > Source: am a manager. > I'm blocked, woe is me" is garbage As a manager, are you prepared to put your real name to these comments?
- stevep98 9y ago
  I don't see what his real name has to do with this
- mrep 9y ago
  > As a manager, are you prepared to put your real name to these comments? This is an anonymous public forum with a massive audience and great content. Let's keep it civil and not target individuals. Please don't try and start witch hunts to ruin someone's career just because you do not agree with him.
some_account 9y ago
The way you talk makes me think you don't like people very much, which is really bad in a manager.

orbitur 9y ago

The employee needs to be taught that. If they've entered the workforce without that knowledge, then it's their manager's responsibility.

epicureanideal 9y ago

I think your specification of a "correct way to report a problem" is company specific, or your personal preference, or the way that you think an ideal problem report would be stated. We're humans. Unless there's been a training day or a Readme file explaining HOW to report a bug, I think it's perfectly reasonable to expect this protocol to work: "I'm blocked!" "Why?" "{reason}" If nobody ACKs the "I'm blocked" message, it's reasonable for someone to think that nobody cares or nobody is listening. This is a normal human protocol, as used in most human environments. "{problem}!" "What's happening? How can I help?" (any considerate person nearby responds)

mratzloff 9y ago
"I'm blocked because on compile I get such-and-such error message and I don't know how to fix it. Who is the right person to ask about this?" I just cut your protocol complexity by half. ;-)
- kirkules 9y ago
  S/he wasn't proposing a protocol, but describing a naturally occurring one.
- dzamo_norton 9y ago
  Same complexity, just less chatty.

thereare5lights 9y ago

It takes a certain kind of person to interpret ""I'm blocked" as "I'm blocked, woe is me" instead of "I'm blocked. Can anyone that sees this help me?" Those people should never be managers.

bitcraft 9y ago
I disagree. A manager should be skeptical to ensure everyone is pulling their weight and being truthful.
- thegayngler 9y ago
  If they don't trust the employee they need to fire them.
  - bitcraft 9y ago
    I agree with you that employees that you cannot trust should be fired. Skepticism doesn’t necessarily mean lack of trust. It’s possible to trust dishonest people and without a skeptical view to be aware that people may be dishonest, even in small ways, it is easy to fall into that trap of trusting good liars.

pm90 9y ago

You will get a lot of downvotes for making that statement here... but let me just say I agree with you 100%. The people I see that get the most work done aren’t the ones crying publicly for help on a nebulous problem, but asking very specific questions about specific problems. In cases one doesn’t make progress, escalate to the manager giving details about exactly what is going on, how many times you reached out to another team and got no answers. That gives the manager ammunition to talk to their peers on other teams or escalate to higher ups. It’s rather unrealistic for the manager to be understanding all the time and coax a team member to give all details of every problem...

JBlue42 9y ago
That's how I was taught (via managers on reddit actually, not irl). Dig as far as you can, record it all, then escalate. You also have to gauge how critical it is and how much of your time (esp. if other things are building up) to spend on it as a factor of when to take it up the line. Tbh, I haven't had any managers lately that have been that great but I'm still holding out hope.

TheSpiceIsLife 9y ago

> What a complete lack of individual ownership. Even the best manager can't help somebody who is unwilling to help themselves. > Source: am a manager. > I'm blocked, woe is me" is garbage As a manager, are you prepared to put your real name to these comments?

stevep98 9y ago
I don't see what his real name has to do with this
mrep 9y ago
> As a manager, are you prepared to put your real name to these comments? This is an anonymous public forum with a massive audience and great content. Let's keep it civil and not target individuals. Please don't try and start witch hunts to ruin someone's career just because you do not agree with him.

some_account 9y ago

The way you talk makes me think you don't like people very much, which is really bad in a manager.