5 ms·

> The only thing that GDPR wants from you is to handle others data with same RESPECT as you handle yours. Plus a minimum of 20M€ fine in case they don't think

by 77pt77 9y ago

> The only thing that GDPR wants from you is to handle others data with same RESPECT as you handle yours. Plus a minimum of 20M€ fine in case they don't think your "common sense" is good enough. For a one man shop that is not working under the legal protection an LLC or equivalent provides, this can be deadly!

huwdiprose 9y ago
€20mil is the maximum, and there are lower tiers for lesser infractions. That is a figure used to bring non-European companies who wish to trade in the EEA but not comply to the negotiating table. We rarely see the largest tier of fines here in the UK, I'd expect little to change there too. Reputational damage should be a focus of anyone concerned with risk here.
- _o_ 9y ago
  Not really true :) $20mil or 4% global revenue whichever is higher. $20mil is nothing for ggl/fb/... This time EU did it right, I doubt some small local shop will ever get max punishment but the % of global revenue is on the other side still something that can bite global corporations.
  - 77pt77 9y ago
    > I doubt some small local shop will ever get max punishment Why? It's selective prosecution, plain and simple. These things have a history of being selectively used to punish institutions for other reasons that are not easy to do using the law To the people downvoting, imagine the following scenario: Website promotes ideas the EU finds problematic. The EU wants to silence it but can't because of free-speech laws or any other constraint. All they have to do is find something trivial under this law and punish them for it, bankrupting the company. All of these "I hope the law will be applied reasonably" are dangerous because they give the state too much power.
    - klokoman 9y ago
      Nobody believes the legislators have ill intent. Then they find themselves ruined but waking up then is hard too.
      - 77pt77 9y ago
        What this law means is that I'll never do any business, even freelance, without being shielded by an LLC.
        klokoman 9y ago
        Not just business, even information websites are affected. This is the most vicious attack against freedom of speech the EU ever pulled off.
        outsideoflife 9y ago
        Could you elaborate on how this is a restriction on freedom of speech? How is an 'information site' affected? Take HN for example, when I signed up they didn't even ask my name. They probably log IP addresses and would be entitled to, for the purposes of analyzing malicious use.
        peoplewindow 9y ago
        It's all PII. People post personal details about their lives here, some use their real names as their username, the site asks for email addresses, how is it not PII? As for IPs. Any website could claim they need IP addresses for analyzing malicious use. So either it'll be a new cookie law in which they all use the vagueness of the new rules to loophole themselves out, or the EU will decide that this is only "reasonable" sometimes. The law effectively says nothing so whether or not HN would be entitled to store this data is essentially undefined. Here's what will really happen to HN - nothing. But Google will get huge fines for doing exactly the same thing, and everyone will be left wondering if they're next.
notyourday 9y ago
Good luck to EU trying to enforce it against JoeSchmoeLLC from PA
- 77pt77 9y ago
  What if the owner is a citizen of a EU country? I'm genuinely curious.
  - notyourday 9y ago
    Maybe they can do that, but that would require piercing corporate veil first which is costly. JoeSchmoeLLC is probably judgement proof. Any attempt to force it to comply would cost a boat load of money. However, it is a lot more likely that the LLC is owned by those with no nexus to Europe it is extremely unlikely that EU can do anything to punish this company. Hell 99% of web forums have European users. Maybe it will have teeth against Google/Facebook/Tinder/Match/etc because those companies actually have assets in Europe but it won't be effective against companies with no nexus.
- wila 9y ago
  Not really a problem for EU if JoeSchmoeLLC is really treating this as not a law for them. US and pretty much every country in the EU have excellent extradition agreements. [0] [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_extradition_treaties https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_extradit...
  - michaelmrose 9y ago
    Do you have any examples of the US extraditing anyone to Europe for actions not considered criminal in the United States.
  - jakeogh 9y ago
    Extradition for what? Violating EU law? I do that almost every second of every day. PA is not subject to EU law whatsoever.

by 77pt77 9y ago

huwdiprose 9y ago

€20mil is the maximum, and there are lower tiers for lesser infractions. That is a figure used to bring non-European companies who wish to trade in the EEA but not comply to the negotiating table. We rarely see the largest tier of fines here in the UK, I'd expect little to change there too. Reputational damage should be a focus of anyone concerned with risk here.

_o_ 9y ago
Not really true :) $20mil or 4% global revenue whichever is higher. $20mil is nothing for ggl/fb/... This time EU did it right, I doubt some small local shop will ever get max punishment but the % of global revenue is on the other side still something that can bite global corporations.
- 77pt77 9y ago
  > I doubt some small local shop will ever get max punishment Why? It's selective prosecution, plain and simple. These things have a history of being selectively used to punish institutions for other reasons that are not easy to do using the law To the people downvoting, imagine the following scenario: Website promotes ideas the EU finds problematic. The EU wants to silence it but can't because of free-speech laws or any other constraint. All they have to do is find something trivial under this law and punish them for it, bankrupting the company. All of these "I hope the law will be applied reasonably" are dangerous because they give the state too much power.
  - klokoman 9y ago
    Nobody believes the legislators have ill intent. Then they find themselves ruined but waking up then is hard too.
    - 77pt77 9y ago
      What this law means is that I'll never do any business, even freelance, without being shielded by an LLC.
      - klokoman 9y ago
        Not just business, even information websites are affected. This is the most vicious attack against freedom of speech the EU ever pulled off.
        outsideoflife 9y ago
        Could you elaborate on how this is a restriction on freedom of speech? How is an 'information site' affected? Take HN for example, when I signed up they didn't even ask my name. They probably log IP addresses and would be entitled to, for the purposes of analyzing malicious use.
        peoplewindow 9y ago
        It's all PII. People post personal details about their lives here, some use their real names as their username, the site asks for email addresses, how is it not PII? As for IPs. Any website could claim they need IP addresses for analyzing malicious use. So either it'll be a new cookie law in which they all use the vagueness of the new rules to loophole themselves out, or the EU will decide that this is only "reasonable" sometimes. The law effectively says nothing so whether or not HN would be entitled to store this data is essentially undefined. Here's what will really happen to HN - nothing. But Google will get huge fines for doing exactly the same thing, and everyone will be left wondering if they're next.

notyourday 9y ago

Good luck to EU trying to enforce it against JoeSchmoeLLC from PA

77pt77 9y ago
What if the owner is a citizen of a EU country? I'm genuinely curious.
- notyourday 9y ago
  Maybe they can do that, but that would require piercing corporate veil first which is costly. JoeSchmoeLLC is probably judgement proof. Any attempt to force it to comply would cost a boat load of money. However, it is a lot more likely that the LLC is owned by those with no nexus to Europe it is extremely unlikely that EU can do anything to punish this company. Hell 99% of web forums have European users. Maybe it will have teeth against Google/Facebook/Tinder/Match/etc because those companies actually have assets in Europe but it won't be effective against companies with no nexus.
wila 9y ago
Not really a problem for EU if JoeSchmoeLLC is really treating this as not a law for them. US and pretty much every country in the EU have excellent extradition agreements. [0] [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_extradition_treaties https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_extradit...
- michaelmrose 9y ago
  Do you have any examples of the US extraditing anyone to Europe for actions not considered criminal in the United States.
- jakeogh 9y ago
  Extradition for what? Violating EU law? I do that almost every second of every day. PA is not subject to EU law whatsoever.