4 ms·

We produce excellent engineers. We also want them badly. We just don't want to pay them.

austincheney 9y ago
I believe I am paid rather well for the work I do, but then I also live in an affordable area. Developers make far more than average wages and often much more than many other careers of similar experience/education requirements. I don't believe wages are the problem or that suddenly inflating wages will magically blossom into a supreme talent surplus. It is possible to make 6 figures as a trash collector, without any education, if you work your ass off. Yet, I don't see people without college rushing into trash collection even though they probably earn less than half of that.
aianus 9y ago
This logically doesn't make any sense. What are they doing then, sitting on their ass at home? Emigrating outside of the US? If not, and they're working, and companies are still having trouble filling positions, how would paying the existing American engineers more fill those outstanding positions?
- rootw0rm 9y ago
  Yes, the whole point of this discussion is how the status quo makes zero sense.
- deleted 9y ago
  [deleted]
- jimmaswell 9y ago
  When I was applying to job openings after college, the very few times I heard back from them, I was offered pay in the range of $15/hr, 35k, etc. for a junior software developer position. Luckily I eventually got something decent but it really is a problem with the companies. There are way more than enough programmers out there, companies just don't want to pay them/don't want to invest in junior devs anymore, as discussed here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16367997 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16367997
  - aianus 9y ago
    What year was this in? It wasn't my experience in college in 2010-2015 at all. Many SV companies recruited mostly useless interns like me and mentored us and paid us well over the median US household income. All in the hopes that we would become useful and join after graduation (at well over six figures salary). And I'm Canadian so they were also paying flights, relocation, visa fees, etc. It doesn't make a lot of sense for them to do these things if it's so easy to hire an American developer at $50k, but maybe their hiring process is that broken?
    - jimmaswell 9y ago
      2017. They could easily fly in students from other states too if they wanted. My experience was in NY.

I believe I am paid rather well for the work I do, but then I also live in an affordable area. Developers make far more than average wages and often much more than many other careers of similar experience/education requirements. I don't believe wages are the problem or that suddenly inflating wages will magically blossom into a supreme talent surplus. It is possible to make 6 figures as a trash collector, without any education, if you work your ass off. Yet, I don't see people without college rushing into trash collection even though they probably earn less than half of that.

aianus 9y ago

This logically doesn't make any sense. What are they doing then, sitting on their ass at home? Emigrating outside of the US? If not, and they're working, and companies are still having trouble filling positions, how would paying the existing American engineers more fill those outstanding positions?

rootw0rm 9y ago
Yes, the whole point of this discussion is how the status quo makes zero sense.
deleted 9y ago
[deleted]
jimmaswell 9y ago
When I was applying to job openings after college, the very few times I heard back from them, I was offered pay in the range of $15/hr, 35k, etc. for a junior software developer position. Luckily I eventually got something decent but it really is a problem with the companies. There are way more than enough programmers out there, companies just don't want to pay them/don't want to invest in junior devs anymore, as discussed here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16367997 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16367997
- aianus 9y ago
  What year was this in? It wasn't my experience in college in 2010-2015 at all. Many SV companies recruited mostly useless interns like me and mentored us and paid us well over the median US household income. All in the hopes that we would become useful and join after graduation (at well over six figures salary). And I'm Canadian so they were also paying flights, relocation, visa fees, etc. It doesn't make a lot of sense for them to do these things if it's so easy to hire an American developer at $50k, but maybe their hiring process is that broken?
  - jimmaswell 9y ago
    2017. They could easily fly in students from other states too if they wanted. My experience was in NY.