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What is the rationale ? Are disposable plastic bags really that much worse than reusable / paper bags ? From what I understand plastic waste is usually burned f

What is the rationale ? Are disposable plastic bags really that much worse than reusable / paper bags ? From what I understand plastic waste is usually burned for electricity or heat in industrial processes, and it's not that much worse than natural gas.

hannob 9y ago
> From what I understand plastic waste is usually burned for electricity or heat in industrial processes, Except for the ones that end up in the ocean: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Pacific_garbage_patch https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Pacific_garbage_patch
- fvdessen 9y ago
  The plastic that ends up in the ocean comes from places & countries that have no waste management at all besides dumping garbage directly in rivers and the ocean. I doubt that's the case for Taiwan.
  - craftyguy 9y ago
    I was in Taiwan a couple years ago doing a beach cleanup, plastics (bags, etc) most definitely make it into the water there.
    - wnissen 9y ago
      Right, but most of them are getting landfilled at the worst, right? As I understand it, the majority of the garbage is coming from countries that have no commercial-scale waste disposal except ocean dumping.
      - craftyguy 9y ago
        Most != all, and it doesn't take much plastic to really mess up an ecosystem. Specifically in north Taiwan's case, I recall learning that a portion of the trash in the ocean comes from China via ocean currents, but there's still a significant amount coming from Taiwan via accidents (trash spilling, vessels losing it, etc)
      - always_good 9y ago
        Well, if we're guessing, surely developed nations produce an order of magnitude more waste in general. Just like the average American consumers more energy than everyone else.
        fvdessen 9y ago
        We don't have to guess, according to this source, 98% of marine litter comes from outside Europe & US [1]. [1] https://www.marinelitterthefacts.com/sources https://www.marinelitterthefacts.com/sources
        craftyguy 9y ago
        Taiwan is outside Europe and the US. So that statistic doesn't really help prove the point that most of the trash in the ocean around Taiwan is from other countries that dump straight into the ocean.
  - HumanDrivenDev 9y ago
    Dumping rubbish directly off the coast, on an industrial scale, often happens in Taiwan. You can see this by visiting practically any beach there. I was in Taidong in October, on the South East of the island which is supposed to be less polluted, and the beach was strewn with washed up plastic.
nmeofthestate 9y ago
The argument seems to be that plastic bags are bad for generating litter. Also there will be a general feel-good argument that plastic is bad so banning bags is good. It's good to feel good as the planet fails to deal with serious environmental issues like global warming. Stuff like this lets politicians court the green vote with measures that are relatively deliverable, and they probably sincerely feel it is making a difference.

hannob 9y ago

> From what I understand plastic waste is usually burned for electricity or heat in industrial processes, Except for the ones that end up in the ocean: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Pacific_garbage_patch https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Pacific_garbage_patch

fvdessen 9y ago
The plastic that ends up in the ocean comes from places & countries that have no waste management at all besides dumping garbage directly in rivers and the ocean. I doubt that's the case for Taiwan.
- craftyguy 9y ago
  I was in Taiwan a couple years ago doing a beach cleanup, plastics (bags, etc) most definitely make it into the water there.
  - wnissen 9y ago
    Right, but most of them are getting landfilled at the worst, right? As I understand it, the majority of the garbage is coming from countries that have no commercial-scale waste disposal except ocean dumping.
    - craftyguy 9y ago
      Most != all, and it doesn't take much plastic to really mess up an ecosystem. Specifically in north Taiwan's case, I recall learning that a portion of the trash in the ocean comes from China via ocean currents, but there's still a significant amount coming from Taiwan via accidents (trash spilling, vessels losing it, etc)
    - always_good 9y ago
      Well, if we're guessing, surely developed nations produce an order of magnitude more waste in general. Just like the average American consumers more energy than everyone else.
      - fvdessen 9y ago
        We don't have to guess, according to this source, 98% of marine litter comes from outside Europe & US [1]. [1] https://www.marinelitterthefacts.com/sources https://www.marinelitterthefacts.com/sources
        craftyguy 9y ago
        Taiwan is outside Europe and the US. So that statistic doesn't really help prove the point that most of the trash in the ocean around Taiwan is from other countries that dump straight into the ocean.
- HumanDrivenDev 9y ago
  Dumping rubbish directly off the coast, on an industrial scale, often happens in Taiwan. You can see this by visiting practically any beach there. I was in Taidong in October, on the South East of the island which is supposed to be less polluted, and the beach was strewn with washed up plastic.

nmeofthestate 9y ago

The argument seems to be that plastic bags are bad for generating litter. Also there will be a general feel-good argument that plastic is bad so banning bags is good. It's good to feel good as the planet fails to deal with serious environmental issues like global warming. Stuff like this lets politicians court the green vote with measures that are relatively deliverable, and they probably sincerely feel it is making a difference.