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So. This is one software writing into a reserved area of a drive and then complaining about another piece of software that does the same. Granted. One is for b

by pilif 16y ago

So. This is one software writing into a reserved area of a drive and then complaining about another piece of software that does the same. Granted. One is for booting an operating system, the other for DRM purposes. But both are doing stuff they should not, so IMHO there's not much reason for complaints. edit: I notice that I'm getting downvoted. Care to explain why? That embedding area isn't something you are supposed to write data to. Now, some software out there still does it (grub2, truecrypt and various DRM solutions unser windows), but that doesn't give the maker of one software the right to blame the maker of another piece of software for writing there. Both should find a better solution, but this certainly isn't a bug in either software - both work around the specification and are getting bitten.

spicyj 16y ago
The problem is that when a user installs an application like Photoshop, he doesn't expect it to change anything outside of the operating system partition that it's being installed on because it has absolutely no right to be anywhere else. In contrast, a bootloader like GRUB2 inherently works at a much lower level than user applications and is expected to modify certain things on the hard disk that would not belong to any operating system because it can assume (almost always) that it is the only bootloader on the disk.
- woodall 16y ago
  when a user installs an application like Photoshop, he doesn't expect it to change anything outside of the operating system partition This still does not make it right for GRUB et al. to call claim to that area of the hard disk. If anyone can write to it, for what ever their needs may be, then forethought should have said, "hey, this can potentially screw some stuff up. We should find a BETTER way". I use GRUB as my primary bootloader and I still cannot get on their side in this debate.
  - jrockway 16y ago
    Clearly the solution is to use a boot floopy.
    - pilif 16y ago
      While that would indeed work, I'm sure there must be a better way. One that always works is to put all the grub stuff into its own primary partition and make that one bootable. Of course that would greatly complicate the installation process, but maybe grub can reuse some of the work that was done for parted. If grub was in its own partition, the likelihood of it being broken by third party software is much lower. What could happen is that some software resets the boot partition flag, but that's easily restored. In case of EFI, if I understand correctly, you can even mark any file on any partition bootable (blessing the file is the term, I think), which makes it even easier.
    - deleted 16y ago
      [deleted]
    - woodall 16y ago
      OR they could install to a protected partition and flag it as bootable. I understand that it is a nuisance, however, oh well. Sometimes shit sucks and you just have to wade it out until shit doesn't suck so bad. It would be nice to have a program that wipes that part of an HDD from time to time; as to not get caught in the DRM trap.

by pilif 16y ago

spicyj 16y ago

The problem is that when a user installs an application like Photoshop, he doesn't expect it to change anything outside of the operating system partition that it's being installed on because it has absolutely no right to be anywhere else. In contrast, a bootloader like GRUB2 inherently works at a much lower level than user applications and is expected to modify certain things on the hard disk that would not belong to any operating system because it can assume (almost always) that it is the only bootloader on the disk.

woodall 16y ago
when a user installs an application like Photoshop, he doesn't expect it to change anything outside of the operating system partition This still does not make it right for GRUB et al. to call claim to that area of the hard disk. If anyone can write to it, for what ever their needs may be, then forethought should have said, "hey, this can potentially screw some stuff up. We should find a BETTER way". I use GRUB as my primary bootloader and I still cannot get on their side in this debate.
- jrockway 16y ago
  Clearly the solution is to use a boot floopy.
  - pilif 16y ago
    While that would indeed work, I'm sure there must be a better way. One that always works is to put all the grub stuff into its own primary partition and make that one bootable. Of course that would greatly complicate the installation process, but maybe grub can reuse some of the work that was done for parted. If grub was in its own partition, the likelihood of it being broken by third party software is much lower. What could happen is that some software resets the boot partition flag, but that's easily restored. In case of EFI, if I understand correctly, you can even mark any file on any partition bootable (blessing the file is the term, I think), which makes it even easier.
  - deleted 16y ago
    [deleted]
  - woodall 16y ago
    OR they could install to a protected partition and flag it as bootable. I understand that it is a nuisance, however, oh well. Sometimes shit sucks and you just have to wade it out until shit doesn't suck so bad. It would be nice to have a program that wipes that part of an HDD from time to time; as to not get caught in the DRM trap.