4 ms·

To the latter point, I have a female physicist friend who hates the "diversity of viewpoints" argument for women in the sciences, the idea that she has some kin

To the latter point, I have a female physicist friend who hates the "diversity of viewpoints" argument for women in the sciences, the idea that she has some kind of "feminine" take on the equations that confers special treatment.

jerf 16y ago
For sciences, I would agree. Science and mathematics are a foreign mindset for everybody, man and woman alike; if any human wishes to pursue them they must bend to it and not vice versa. For software I'd be less certain. It is well-known that being your own customer can be a powerful thing. It is not inconceivable that on average men and women may approach computing tasks somewhat differently, different goals, different metaphors, different preferred cognitive frameworks. And while I wouldn't necessarily expect them to be night and day different, as Apple shows getting those last tiny details nailed down can make a huge difference in how a product feels. If men even slightly prefer one thing and women slightly prefer another, an interface tuned for one or another slight difference could manifest as a huge impact on the pleasure of using the software. Unfortunately, we are reduced to hypothesizing here because I am not aware of any amount of study on the topic. All I can say is that it is certainly conceivable and not necessarily unfair. I would also suspect that if such differences exist they are likely to be as I said above more in the cognitive domain than in the more stereotypical appearance domain. I don't know per se that women will necessarily respond to a more rounded or pink or whatever stereotypical visual thing you might initially come up with, I suspect it'll be something more like men prefer more spatial organization, say for MP3s, whereas women may prefer more word-based and tagging organization, just to give one example. (And as you can see from that example there's going to be substantial overlap no matter what.) I'm not claiming this difference would even hold true, I offer it merely as an example of a cognitive preference.
lingrush 16y ago
I am in the same situation as I'm a studying mathematician, but I think she neglects to acknowledge the (extreme) politics of the scientific fields that necessitates a diversity of viewpoints. I know far more people who have issues with that.
sliverstorm 16y ago
I find myself highly amused trying to imagine what great insight the 'female perspective' might bring to physics (or pure math)

jerf 16y ago

For sciences, I would agree. Science and mathematics are a foreign mindset for everybody, man and woman alike; if any human wishes to pursue them they must bend to it and not vice versa. For software I'd be less certain. It is well-known that being your own customer can be a powerful thing. It is not inconceivable that on average men and women may approach computing tasks somewhat differently, different goals, different metaphors, different preferred cognitive frameworks. And while I wouldn't necessarily expect them to be night and day different, as Apple shows getting those last tiny details nailed down can make a huge difference in how a product feels. If men even slightly prefer one thing and women slightly prefer another, an interface tuned for one or another slight difference could manifest as a huge impact on the pleasure of using the software. Unfortunately, we are reduced to hypothesizing here because I am not aware of any amount of study on the topic. All I can say is that it is certainly conceivable and not necessarily unfair. I would also suspect that if such differences exist they are likely to be as I said above more in the cognitive domain than in the more stereotypical appearance domain. I don't know per se that women will necessarily respond to a more rounded or pink or whatever stereotypical visual thing you might initially come up with, I suspect it'll be something more like men prefer more spatial organization, say for MP3s, whereas women may prefer more word-based and tagging organization, just to give one example. (And as you can see from that example there's going to be substantial overlap no matter what.) I'm not claiming this difference would even hold true, I offer it merely as an example of a cognitive preference.

lingrush 16y ago

I am in the same situation as I'm a studying mathematician, but I think she neglects to acknowledge the (extreme) politics of the scientific fields that necessitates a diversity of viewpoints. I know far more people who have issues with that.

sliverstorm 16y ago

I find myself highly amused trying to imagine what great insight the 'female perspective' might bring to physics (or pure math)