5 ms·

See Slack. If Slack were still some plucky startup, I can understand it using Electron. But it's been around for a while now, and a more performant native appli

See Slack. If Slack were still some plucky startup, I can understand it using Electron. But it's been around for a while now, and a more performant native application doesn't seem to be coming anytime soon.

Aelius 9y ago
Luckily Slack has the IRC and XMPP bridges. can't imagine any other protocols with a wealth of highly performant clients to choose from. Unlucky for me, my admins refuse to enable the bridges and also won't grant me an API key for use with the weechat slack plugin. I hate Slack so much. Slow and miserable and unconfigurable and just crashes at least once a month.
- detaro 9y ago
  Sadly, Slack also happily breaks the protocols in their bridges, e.g. producing invalid IRC usernames. So even though our Slack has the bridge enabled, I can't login to it since it wants me to put a dot in my nick.
laurent123456 9y ago
Skype for a long time only had an outdated application on Linux. Now that MS converted it to Electron, it's available and regularly updated. The truth is, even for huge companies like Microsoft, the cost of doing a Linux-specific app is not worth it given the small user base, but with Electron they get this for free so they do it. This is even more true for resource-limited open source projects, as cross-platform gui-based ones are difficult to get right, but Electron makes that easier.
- karpodiem 9y ago
  Now I've heard it all - a company with a seven hundred billion dollar market cap can't afford it. Come on. They can absolutely afford to do native Windows / MacOS / Linux cross platform. They're lazy/don't want to.
  - alsetmusic 9y ago
    > Now I've heard it all - a company with a seven hundred billion dollar market cap can't afford it. Come on. They can absolutely afford to do native Windows / MacOS / Linux cross platform. They're lazy/don't want to. That’s a straw man argument. The parent said that Linux development might not be worth the cost. They didn’t say anything about the ability to pay.
    - v_lisivka 9y ago
      So we, linux users, actively promoting alternatives for Skype, to increase cost of ignoring us. «Team, M$ killed Skype for linux, I cannot use it anymore, let switch to something else, like Slack.»
  - gbersac 9y ago
    They can do it but if it's not profitable, they won't. It's not being lazy, it's being smart in the capitalist sense.
    - karpodiem 9y ago
      I'm fine with that, just call it like it is. This is what Microsoft truly thinks of developing a 1st class open-source solution - not worth their time because it's not profitable enough. So they'll give you a second class solution with the assumption you'd rather have that then nothing.
  - RaleyField 9y ago
    They can afford it. They can also afford to put a man on the moon, but it isn't necessarily financially reasonable for them to do so. Think of Microsoft as a collection of teams, each team can't afford to spend "Microsoft" money on its project unless its strategically important. The fact that we don't have native app probably indicates that Microsoft thinks Skype is past its peak of popularity. Thinking of many competing products I understand why.
- danieldk 9y ago
  Skype for a long time only had an outdated application on Linux. Now that MS converted it to Electron, it's available and regularly updated. And now Mac users get the same terrible Electron app. The problem is that companies are not just making Electron apps for Linux users. They are replacing native well-integrated Mac and Windows applications by Electron apps (Skype) or do not consider writing native apps (Slack). So, we had nicely integrated applications with Automator workflows, consistent shortcuts, consistent look and consistent feel. And we are replacing them by things that do not fit into the platform at all. No thanks.
- xioxox 9y ago
  Skype used to have a small, snappy and useful app for Linux. Now that MS converted it to Electron, I no longer use it. Qt makes multiplatform apps trivial. Even I, as a hobbyist free software developer, can provide binaries for Linux, Windows and Mac.
- jrs95 9y ago
  A lot of people, myself included, actually preferred the Linux version of Skype. But to be honest, I'd rather have no GUI app on Mac/Linux at all than have it basically be a requirement to waste resources on Slack or whatever other crap and to have developer energy tied up in an editor as shitty as Atom.
amedvednikov 9y ago
I'm working on a native client for Slack, Skype, Twitter etc. It's only 90 KB (!) https://eul.im https://eul.im
- blackoil 9y ago
  Is it 90kb installer or complete app? Also what are using to build the interface?
  - amedvednikov 9y ago
    It's the complete app. Cocoa on macos, WinAPI on Windows, GTK on Linux.
- stephenr 9y ago
  Is this the one that uses OpenGL or something to render everything (ie nonnative text controls etc)?
  - amedvednikov 9y ago
    Not any more. Now it uses native controls.
    - stephenr 9y ago
      Oh nice, I need to check this out then!
- mamcx 9y ago
  How you do this? Probably some of us could guess, but maybe will help people that only know electron :)
  - amedvednikov 9y ago
    Cocoa on macOS, WinAPI on Windows, GTK on Linux.
- 9y ago

Aelius 9y ago

Luckily Slack has the IRC and XMPP bridges. can't imagine any other protocols with a wealth of highly performant clients to choose from. Unlucky for me, my admins refuse to enable the bridges and also won't grant me an API key for use with the weechat slack plugin. I hate Slack so much. Slow and miserable and unconfigurable and just crashes at least once a month.

detaro 9y ago
Sadly, Slack also happily breaks the protocols in their bridges, e.g. producing invalid IRC usernames. So even though our Slack has the bridge enabled, I can't login to it since it wants me to put a dot in my nick.

laurent123456 9y ago

Skype for a long time only had an outdated application on Linux. Now that MS converted it to Electron, it's available and regularly updated. The truth is, even for huge companies like Microsoft, the cost of doing a Linux-specific app is not worth it given the small user base, but with Electron they get this for free so they do it. This is even more true for resource-limited open source projects, as cross-platform gui-based ones are difficult to get right, but Electron makes that easier.

karpodiem 9y ago
Now I've heard it all - a company with a seven hundred billion dollar market cap can't afford it. Come on. They can absolutely afford to do native Windows / MacOS / Linux cross platform. They're lazy/don't want to.
- alsetmusic 9y ago
  > Now I've heard it all - a company with a seven hundred billion dollar market cap can't afford it. Come on. They can absolutely afford to do native Windows / MacOS / Linux cross platform. They're lazy/don't want to. That’s a straw man argument. The parent said that Linux development might not be worth the cost. They didn’t say anything about the ability to pay.
  - v_lisivka 9y ago
    So we, linux users, actively promoting alternatives for Skype, to increase cost of ignoring us. «Team, M$ killed Skype for linux, I cannot use it anymore, let switch to something else, like Slack.»
- gbersac 9y ago
  They can do it but if it's not profitable, they won't. It's not being lazy, it's being smart in the capitalist sense.
  - karpodiem 9y ago
    I'm fine with that, just call it like it is. This is what Microsoft truly thinks of developing a 1st class open-source solution - not worth their time because it's not profitable enough. So they'll give you a second class solution with the assumption you'd rather have that then nothing.
- RaleyField 9y ago
  They can afford it. They can also afford to put a man on the moon, but it isn't necessarily financially reasonable for them to do so. Think of Microsoft as a collection of teams, each team can't afford to spend "Microsoft" money on its project unless its strategically important. The fact that we don't have native app probably indicates that Microsoft thinks Skype is past its peak of popularity. Thinking of many competing products I understand why.
danieldk 9y ago
Skype for a long time only had an outdated application on Linux. Now that MS converted it to Electron, it's available and regularly updated. And now Mac users get the same terrible Electron app. The problem is that companies are not just making Electron apps for Linux users. They are replacing native well-integrated Mac and Windows applications by Electron apps (Skype) or do not consider writing native apps (Slack). So, we had nicely integrated applications with Automator workflows, consistent shortcuts, consistent look and consistent feel. And we are replacing them by things that do not fit into the platform at all. No thanks.
xioxox 9y ago
Skype used to have a small, snappy and useful app for Linux. Now that MS converted it to Electron, I no longer use it. Qt makes multiplatform apps trivial. Even I, as a hobbyist free software developer, can provide binaries for Linux, Windows and Mac.
jrs95 9y ago
A lot of people, myself included, actually preferred the Linux version of Skype. But to be honest, I'd rather have no GUI app on Mac/Linux at all than have it basically be a requirement to waste resources on Slack or whatever other crap and to have developer energy tied up in an editor as shitty as Atom.

amedvednikov 9y ago

I'm working on a native client for Slack, Skype, Twitter etc. It's only 90 KB (!) https://eul.im https://eul.im

blackoil 9y ago
Is it 90kb installer or complete app? Also what are using to build the interface?
- amedvednikov 9y ago
  It's the complete app. Cocoa on macos, WinAPI on Windows, GTK on Linux.
stephenr 9y ago
Is this the one that uses OpenGL or something to render everything (ie nonnative text controls etc)?
- amedvednikov 9y ago
  Not any more. Now it uses native controls.
  - stephenr 9y ago
    Oh nice, I need to check this out then!
mamcx 9y ago
How you do this? Probably some of us could guess, but maybe will help people that only know electron :)
- amedvednikov 9y ago
  Cocoa on macOS, WinAPI on Windows, GTK on Linux.
9y ago