9 ms·

I used to be a huge Waze fan, and I do still use it, but both Apple Maps and Google Maps provide much better UX in a lot of ways: I really miss lane guidance, f

I used to be a huge Waze fan, and I do still use it, but both Apple Maps and Google Maps provide much better UX in a lot of ways: I really miss lane guidance, for instance. I think Waze still has the best traffic guidance, but I'm pretty sure the number of times I've clicked "yes, now that you've shown me this ad, I would like you to stop the route I'm on now and take me 17 minutes out of my way to go to the nearest Burger King, thanks" is 0%. Also, whoever thought it was a great idea to permanently stick a button in the user interface that brings up an ad for Waze Carpool needs to be soundly whipped. I mean, I don't have any studies to back this up, but I'm pretty sure that when someone is in their car already, using Waze, they don't need to schedule a carpool pickup. Because they're in their car. Driving.

username223 9y ago
How do these things even exist? Obviously the people in the cars don't want them, and will never use them. Even the people A/B testing them should eventually figure that out.
- mseebach 9y ago
  I suppose it's the "better horse" paradox. A/B testing can only get you incremental improvements, to make the leap from a really good horse to a car, you need to make a bet and sustain it for a bit to get people comfortable enough to decide to try it out. That's not to say that whatever Waze is doing is a good idea, but that may well be the underlying mechanism for why they're trying.
  - _carl_jung 9y ago
    > better horse I've been looking for a way to articulate this problem in A/B testing, thanks.
  - panarky 9y ago
    When hundreds of people try to ride the same horse at the same time, is it still better? That's what I call a "better horse paradox".
- pjc50 9y ago
  Presumably they get paid to put them in regardless of whether they are used; and enough people accidentally click it that it stays in use.
cm2187 9y ago
Is it even safe to ask you to click buttons while driving?
- chrisper 9y ago
  The ads only come when you are fully stopped (e.g. traffic light).
  - hobofan 9y ago
    Does it also check for a stopped engine? Here in Germany the laws regarding texting and driving only regard a car as not driving if it is standing still and the engine is turned off.
    - dingaling 9y ago
      How does that integrate with the prevalence of stop-start engine technology nowadays? In the UK it is only permissible if the engine is off AND the car is parked in a recognised or safe parking area. Engine off waiting at junction is not sufficient.
      - Odenwaelder 9y ago
        It is the same in Germany.
        germanier 9y ago
        Using your phone at an intersection is completely legal in Germany as long as you turn your car off. Not that anyone would advise you to do so.
        dx034 9y ago
        May I ask for a source? I heard the opposite. Your car must not participate in traffic when you use the phone. It's fine if you're parked somewhere and have the engine off. But being parked at an intersection where people would expect you to react to traffic doesn't allow you to use the phone.
maccard 9y ago
> I really miss lane guidance, for instance Can I ask why? Having driven in both the US and europe and used GMaps in both places, I've found the lane guidance to be borderline useless. For the most part, lanes are intuitive (turning right - right lane), and when they're not, Google often gets them wrong.
- crdb 9y ago
  Google Maps has been a lifesaver in Sydney CBD for me as a driver unfamiliar with the Byzantine lane timing required, lack of signalling, and frequent undocumented works and blockages (I do wish they'd incorporate the random M5 closures though). It does get laggy and imprecise once you get in the area with tall buildings though.
- alex_duf 9y ago
  I guess it depends where, but in both London and Bordeaux (where I live and where I lived), on a dual carriage way you never know if right lane is right only, or right and straight ahead. Equally, the left lane could be left turn only, or left turn and straight ahead. And unless you've been here before and made the mistake (and got beeped at in the process) you probably won't know nor see the arrows as you're following the car in front of you. I find it very useful (when it works)
  - akie 9y ago
    I had the same issue when I was living in Geneva, especially when driving in dense traffic. You'd be on the right lane of a two lane road, and suddenly it turns to the right while the left lane continues on straight. And obviously there'd be no way to quickly go to the left lane anymore because the traffic is severely stuck anyway. So then you end up driving in the wrong direction, still stuck in traffic, and have to take a (sometimes significant) detour. Happened to me more than a few times, and the only way you can avoid it is if you know all the local roads, or if your navigation software knows it...
    - IncRnd 9y ago
      Don't the street signs give you an indication that a lane branches off?
mdip 9y ago
> "yes, now that you've shown me this ad, I would like you to stop the route I'm on now and take me 17 minutes out of my way to go to the nearest Burger King, thanks" is 0%. Oh my is that obnoxious. I'm a daily Waze user, personally, and I find this to be the stupidest dialog the app produces. It pops up every few times you end up stopped at a light -- the moment I want to look at the app to check the route it's sent me on -- and there's a dialog covering up half the screen with no obvious "go away" button (is there one? Can I swipe it away? Who knows? I'm driving and don't have time to figure that out!). And I'm like you ... who on earth is clicking these ads on purpose. I could see if I put in a 6-hour route for a road trip -- maybe I hadn't thought of where I'd eat lunch -- but on my drive home from work, am I really using a navigation app and not caring about getting home?
- iainmerrick 9y ago
  Why do you put up with that? Why not just use a different app?
  - ctdonath 9y ago
    Most of the time I do. I only use Waze when on long-haul freeways, concerned about police & other traffic issues. I usually use Apple Maps as general runabout guidance, Google Maps when really concerned about best/scenic routes, Google Earth when interested in topography.
    - freehunter 9y ago
      Whenever I hear people (and I hear it a lot) saying they use Waze to avoid police, I never really understand it. Waze is all user-reported, right? It's not a radar detector. So even if 100% of drivers are Wave users and they report 100% of police waiting at speed traps, there always has to be the first Waze user to encounter that cop without warning from their app. And that 100% number is a huge assumption. I find the more fool-proof way to avoid being pulled over for speeding is to not speed in the first place, at which point both Google Maps and Apple Maps both report any other type of traffic slowdown just as good as Waze without the annoying advertisements.
memco 9y ago
> Also, whoever thought it was a great idea to permanently stick a button in the user interface that brings up an ad for Waze Carpool needs to be soundly whipped Since I do not drive or use Waze for navigation I cannot see how this works for myself, but could it be that they put this there so that you as a driver have an opportunity to start offering to give people rides rather than taking one? As a person without a license, I would very much like to see more drivers in my area. I hope that Waze can find a way to encourage more drivers to opt in (and to do so without being obnoxious or intrusive) so that I could use the service more. So far I have been able to take only one trip in over a month of using the app because there are no matches found. I'm commuting in LA and it's hard to imagine that there are not more people whose commute is similar to mine.
- chipotle_coyote 9y ago
  I presume that's the idea. I'm not questioning the idea as much as this particular implementation. :) If I ran the zoo, I would have sent a message to everyone's inbox (at least, everyone in areas that Waze Carpool exists!) once, then updated the app to have a "Learn about Carpool" link somewhere that is not the main driving screen.

username223 9y ago

How do these things even exist? Obviously the people in the cars don't want them, and will never use them. Even the people A/B testing them should eventually figure that out.

mseebach 9y ago
I suppose it's the "better horse" paradox. A/B testing can only get you incremental improvements, to make the leap from a really good horse to a car, you need to make a bet and sustain it for a bit to get people comfortable enough to decide to try it out. That's not to say that whatever Waze is doing is a good idea, but that may well be the underlying mechanism for why they're trying.
- _carl_jung 9y ago
  > better horse I've been looking for a way to articulate this problem in A/B testing, thanks.
- panarky 9y ago
  When hundreds of people try to ride the same horse at the same time, is it still better? That's what I call a "better horse paradox".
pjc50 9y ago
Presumably they get paid to put them in regardless of whether they are used; and enough people accidentally click it that it stays in use.

cm2187 9y ago

Is it even safe to ask you to click buttons while driving?

chrisper 9y ago
The ads only come when you are fully stopped (e.g. traffic light).
- hobofan 9y ago
  Does it also check for a stopped engine? Here in Germany the laws regarding texting and driving only regard a car as not driving if it is standing still and the engine is turned off.
  - dingaling 9y ago
    How does that integrate with the prevalence of stop-start engine technology nowadays? In the UK it is only permissible if the engine is off AND the car is parked in a recognised or safe parking area. Engine off waiting at junction is not sufficient.
    - Odenwaelder 9y ago
      It is the same in Germany.
      - germanier 9y ago
        Using your phone at an intersection is completely legal in Germany as long as you turn your car off. Not that anyone would advise you to do so.
        dx034 9y ago
        May I ask for a source? I heard the opposite. Your car must not participate in traffic when you use the phone. It's fine if you're parked somewhere and have the engine off. But being parked at an intersection where people would expect you to react to traffic doesn't allow you to use the phone.

maccard 9y ago

> I really miss lane guidance, for instance Can I ask why? Having driven in both the US and europe and used GMaps in both places, I've found the lane guidance to be borderline useless. For the most part, lanes are intuitive (turning right - right lane), and when they're not, Google often gets them wrong.

crdb 9y ago
Google Maps has been a lifesaver in Sydney CBD for me as a driver unfamiliar with the Byzantine lane timing required, lack of signalling, and frequent undocumented works and blockages (I do wish they'd incorporate the random M5 closures though). It does get laggy and imprecise once you get in the area with tall buildings though.
alex_duf 9y ago
I guess it depends where, but in both London and Bordeaux (where I live and where I lived), on a dual carriage way you never know if right lane is right only, or right and straight ahead. Equally, the left lane could be left turn only, or left turn and straight ahead. And unless you've been here before and made the mistake (and got beeped at in the process) you probably won't know nor see the arrows as you're following the car in front of you. I find it very useful (when it works)
- akie 9y ago
  I had the same issue when I was living in Geneva, especially when driving in dense traffic. You'd be on the right lane of a two lane road, and suddenly it turns to the right while the left lane continues on straight. And obviously there'd be no way to quickly go to the left lane anymore because the traffic is severely stuck anyway. So then you end up driving in the wrong direction, still stuck in traffic, and have to take a (sometimes significant) detour. Happened to me more than a few times, and the only way you can avoid it is if you know all the local roads, or if your navigation software knows it...
  - IncRnd 9y ago
    Don't the street signs give you an indication that a lane branches off?

mdip 9y ago

> "yes, now that you've shown me this ad, I would like you to stop the route I'm on now and take me 17 minutes out of my way to go to the nearest Burger King, thanks" is 0%. Oh my is that obnoxious. I'm a daily Waze user, personally, and I find this to be the stupidest dialog the app produces. It pops up every few times you end up stopped at a light -- the moment I want to look at the app to check the route it's sent me on -- and there's a dialog covering up half the screen with no obvious "go away" button (is there one? Can I swipe it away? Who knows? I'm driving and don't have time to figure that out!). And I'm like you ... who on earth is clicking these ads on purpose. I could see if I put in a 6-hour route for a road trip -- maybe I hadn't thought of where I'd eat lunch -- but on my drive home from work, am I really using a navigation app and not caring about getting home?

iainmerrick 9y ago
Why do you put up with that? Why not just use a different app?
- ctdonath 9y ago
  Most of the time I do. I only use Waze when on long-haul freeways, concerned about police & other traffic issues. I usually use Apple Maps as general runabout guidance, Google Maps when really concerned about best/scenic routes, Google Earth when interested in topography.
  - freehunter 9y ago
    Whenever I hear people (and I hear it a lot) saying they use Waze to avoid police, I never really understand it. Waze is all user-reported, right? It's not a radar detector. So even if 100% of drivers are Wave users and they report 100% of police waiting at speed traps, there always has to be the first Waze user to encounter that cop without warning from their app. And that 100% number is a huge assumption. I find the more fool-proof way to avoid being pulled over for speeding is to not speed in the first place, at which point both Google Maps and Apple Maps both report any other type of traffic slowdown just as good as Waze without the annoying advertisements.

memco 9y ago

> Also, whoever thought it was a great idea to permanently stick a button in the user interface that brings up an ad for Waze Carpool needs to be soundly whipped Since I do not drive or use Waze for navigation I cannot see how this works for myself, but could it be that they put this there so that you as a driver have an opportunity to start offering to give people rides rather than taking one? As a person without a license, I would very much like to see more drivers in my area. I hope that Waze can find a way to encourage more drivers to opt in (and to do so without being obnoxious or intrusive) so that I could use the service more. So far I have been able to take only one trip in over a month of using the app because there are no matches found. I'm commuting in LA and it's hard to imagine that there are not more people whose commute is similar to mine.

chipotle_coyote 9y ago
I presume that's the idea. I'm not questioning the idea as much as this particular implementation. :) If I ran the zoo, I would have sent a message to everyone's inbox (at least, everyone in areas that Waze Carpool exists!) once, then updated the app to have a "Learn about Carpool" link somewhere that is not the main driving screen.