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The benefits of that kind of CoC remain to be proven. Meanwhile, I note that HN's moderating guidelines do not mention sex, gender, religion, food choices, or m

by Yver 9y ago

The benefits of that kind of CoC remain to be proven. Meanwhile, I note that HN's moderating guidelines do not mention sex, gender, religion, food choices, or most of what FreeBSD's new CoC describes. HN's moderating guidelines are about content whereas FreeBSD's new Code of Conduct codifies human behaviour, as the name would imply. They are different things.

pvg 9y ago
I note that HN's moderating guidelines do not mention sex, gender, religion, food choices, or most of what FreeBSD's new CoC describes. You might also note that HN regularly fills up with pages upon pages of sexist (more rarely, racist) tripe. Which might be ok for HN but the people who participate in the FreeBSD project have decided it's not ok for their thing.
- youdontknowtho 9y ago
  yeah, ive been wondering if it was just me or if comments were starting to seem more reactionary?
  - youdontknowtho 9y ago
    I guess that would mean yes...
soyiuz 9y ago
To your first point: The detriments of that kind of COC remain to be proven as well. But why even bring this up? Even a perceived benefit to a marginalized group is worth it. Do we imagine the status quo as somehow harmed by stronger anti-harassment policies? There are numerous examples of sexual harassment online and in person. The potential chilling effects of stronger guidelines have to be weighed against the actual chilling effects (trauma, non-participation) of those affected. To your second point: The BSD guidelines address content ("comments") and physical meetings, which I assume apply to conferences and hackathons. I don't see the distinction you are making between "content" and "human behavior," as content is human behavior online. There is good research on moderated communities. Anecdotally, I am talking to you here and not on Reddit because of stronger guidelines (and the resulting, to my mind, higher quality of discussion).
- whatshisface 9y ago
  >I am talking to you here and not on Reddit because of stronger guidelines (and the resulting, to my mind, higher quality of discussion). That's a really interesting statement - I think that it has more to do with the actual people in the community (including the individual people moderating) than the guidelines they wrote. I think that if you took the HN guidelines and told a major subreddit's team to implement them, the discussion there wouldn't get any better. Why? Because it's all dependent on the judgment of the community and the moderators, and you either have that resource (and are already using it) or you don't.
pseudalopex 9y ago
Most of the "human behavior" described in the FreeBSD Code of Conduct is speech.

by Yver 9y ago

pvg 9y ago

I note that HN's moderating guidelines do not mention sex, gender, religion, food choices, or most of what FreeBSD's new CoC describes. You might also note that HN regularly fills up with pages upon pages of sexist (more rarely, racist) tripe. Which might be ok for HN but the people who participate in the FreeBSD project have decided it's not ok for their thing.

youdontknowtho 9y ago
yeah, ive been wondering if it was just me or if comments were starting to seem more reactionary?
- youdontknowtho 9y ago
  I guess that would mean yes...

soyiuz 9y ago

To your first point: The detriments of that kind of COC remain to be proven as well. But why even bring this up? Even a perceived benefit to a marginalized group is worth it. Do we imagine the status quo as somehow harmed by stronger anti-harassment policies? There are numerous examples of sexual harassment online and in person. The potential chilling effects of stronger guidelines have to be weighed against the actual chilling effects (trauma, non-participation) of those affected. To your second point: The BSD guidelines address content ("comments") and physical meetings, which I assume apply to conferences and hackathons. I don't see the distinction you are making between "content" and "human behavior," as content is human behavior online. There is good research on moderated communities. Anecdotally, I am talking to you here and not on Reddit because of stronger guidelines (and the resulting, to my mind, higher quality of discussion).

whatshisface 9y ago
>I am talking to you here and not on Reddit because of stronger guidelines (and the resulting, to my mind, higher quality of discussion). That's a really interesting statement - I think that it has more to do with the actual people in the community (including the individual people moderating) than the guidelines they wrote. I think that if you took the HN guidelines and told a major subreddit's team to implement them, the discussion there wouldn't get any better. Why? Because it's all dependent on the judgment of the community and the moderators, and you either have that resource (and are already using it) or you don't.

pseudalopex 9y ago

Most of the "human behavior" described in the FreeBSD Code of Conduct is speech.