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This was one of the main topics of Orwell's 1984 as well as some of his essays. If you restrict a language, you make it harder to think about certain topics.

This was one of the main topics of Orwell's 1984 as well as some of his essays. If you restrict a language, you make it harder to think about certain topics. Making it impossible is far too strong a statement. Even very rudamentary languages can express virtually any concept. But it can certainly make it harder to think about those concepts, especially highly nuanced ones, with precise words fitted for it. Mathematical history provides a good example of this. There is nothing you can express with Hindu-Arabic numerals that you cannot express with Roman numerals. Yet, the Hindu-Arabic numerals we vastly easier to work with and think about, and their importation into Europe facilitated mathematical development there.

Someone 16y ago
Your argument is flawed, but the example is fine. Roman numerals are restricted in comparison with Arabic ones. AFAIK, there is no way to write "zero" or negative numbers in Roman numerals. Zero, in particular, was a major innovation.
- ithkuil 16y ago
  Roman numerals are now dead, nobody would be taken seriously if he extended the roman numeral system in order to prove that the roman numerals could have a zero (or negatives). Right? But when cultural systems were alive, they routinely changed, adapted, imported concepts. Sometimes they were replaced, but not simply because they lacked something that could be added One could simply add "N" as nulla and invent something for negative numbers or spell it as a full word. The key point in the arabic/hindi zero is not the 'zero' value of the symbol, but the positional feature of the numbering system. The zero just turns out to be useful to express a lot of numbers in a positional system. Zero by himself is probably less useful and as a concept can be expressed as a full word "nulla" if needed. Indeed I just found out that medieval extension of the roman numeral system included 'nulla': http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman_numerals#Zero http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman_numerals#Zero If only Romans had to calculate complicated feast dates like Easter, perhaps they'd found the need to include a zero as the medieval computists did. (honestly I have no idea of either the Ancient Rome festivities nor exactly what they used the numbers for, just guessing)

Someone 16y ago

Your argument is flawed, but the example is fine. Roman numerals are restricted in comparison with Arabic ones. AFAIK, there is no way to write "zero" or negative numbers in Roman numerals. Zero, in particular, was a major innovation.

ithkuil 16y ago
Roman numerals are now dead, nobody would be taken seriously if he extended the roman numeral system in order to prove that the roman numerals could have a zero (or negatives). Right? But when cultural systems were alive, they routinely changed, adapted, imported concepts. Sometimes they were replaced, but not simply because they lacked something that could be added One could simply add "N" as nulla and invent something for negative numbers or spell it as a full word. The key point in the arabic/hindi zero is not the 'zero' value of the symbol, but the positional feature of the numbering system. The zero just turns out to be useful to express a lot of numbers in a positional system. Zero by himself is probably less useful and as a concept can be expressed as a full word "nulla" if needed. Indeed I just found out that medieval extension of the roman numeral system included 'nulla': http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman_numerals#Zero http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman_numerals#Zero If only Romans had to calculate complicated feast dates like Easter, perhaps they'd found the need to include a zero as the medieval computists did. (honestly I have no idea of either the Ancient Rome festivities nor exactly what they used the numbers for, just guessing)