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The FBI is not warning about students, but about government agents posing ad students, I.E. "operatives". Here, they have access to learn and potentially influ

The FBI is not warning about students, but about government agents posing ad students, I.E. "operatives". Here, they have access to learn and potentially influence our culture from within. Most importantly, if the FBI is correct and they exist, they most likely do not have your interests in mind. That said, I don't know how one would deal with this without causing McCarthy style hysteria and sweeping up innocent students along with operatives.

BeetleB 9y ago
>Here, they have access to learn and potentially influence our culture from within. You say that as if it is some nefarious goal, when it is almost always the goal for all international student groups: Promoting their culture. It's not a hidden agenda - it is usually explicit. As others have pointed out, for all the warnings, the article doesn't point out anything particularly bad that these groups on campus do.
geofft 9y ago
> The FBI is not warning about students, but about government agents posing ad students, I.E. "operatives". What is the distinction here? I do not generally expect international students on a student visa, with no intention of becoming citizens, to forget about the interests of their home country and prioritize the interests of the country they're visiting. They're here because the school is good, that's it.
- gowld 9y ago
  Who cares about the "interests of a country"? People care about themselves, family, friends, and charity cases.
  - geofft 9y ago
    They care about cultural values. If you've been raised your whole life to believe that every good thing in your life is because you live under your current political system, your self-interest and interest in your family will manifest as a desire to uphold that political system.
- allthenews 9y ago
  You dont think that Chinese espionage does not potentially extend to our colleges? You dont think the U.S. is doing at least as much elsewhere? All this talk of collusion with Russia recently doesn't bother you either if it is true that a foreign power could have targeted our culture successfully to the point that they threw an election in their favor? Such sentiment would be naive. Particularly in an authoritarian nation swarming with propaganda. There are plenty of children potentially willing to dedicate themselves to the interests of the party, whether for perceived virtue, or fear of retribution.
  - nkurz 9y ago
    You dont think that Chinese espionage does not potentially extend to our colleges? Well, no, I'm not sure what "espionage" would mean here? Does it mean stealing information? Doubtful. Unionizing graduate students? Hard to believe. Thwarting the education of others? Haven't seen it. While the Chinese may be placing people into positions at American universities with the idea that they might one day be useful, I'm not sure what would could as espionage. If anything I'd guess the "operatives" would mostly be keeping track of the activities of other Chinese students, and possibly serving as conduits for more covert operatives, but I'm doubtful they are doing anything that would legally qualify as espionage. You dont think the U.S. is doing at least as much elsewhere? You'd have to be clearer about what the "as much" is, but I'm doubtful the US is putting much effort into putting operatives into academic positions abroad. Probably they want to open channels of communication with people who are already there, but I'm doubtful we're doing anything particularly effective involving "fake" students. And again, what would the goal of this be? All this talk of collusion with Russia recently doesn't bother you Seems worth investigating, but no, nothing I've heard so far bothers me. There are lots of countries that have great interest in affecting/effecting US policies, and I'd presume that Russia would be one of them. I'm doubtful they were particularly effective in influencing an election, though, or even that they were the country with the greatest influence. This is the place where I assume the US is doing much more with regard to other country's elections, possibly with greater impact. Particularly in an authoritarian nation swarming with propaganda. I don't know your politics well enough to know if you mean China, Russia, or the US here? If you point is that there likely exist Chinese students who are willing to do what the Chinese government asks them in return for being allowed to study abroad, then sure. But I'd guess that most of what is being asked is "Learn everything they will teach you and then come home and build a better China", and I think that's a good thing?

BeetleB 9y ago

>Here, they have access to learn and potentially influence our culture from within. You say that as if it is some nefarious goal, when it is almost always the goal for all international student groups: Promoting their culture. It's not a hidden agenda - it is usually explicit. As others have pointed out, for all the warnings, the article doesn't point out anything particularly bad that these groups on campus do.

geofft 9y ago

> The FBI is not warning about students, but about government agents posing ad students, I.E. "operatives". What is the distinction here? I do not generally expect international students on a student visa, with no intention of becoming citizens, to forget about the interests of their home country and prioritize the interests of the country they're visiting. They're here because the school is good, that's it.

gowld 9y ago
Who cares about the "interests of a country"? People care about themselves, family, friends, and charity cases.
- geofft 9y ago
  They care about cultural values. If you've been raised your whole life to believe that every good thing in your life is because you live under your current political system, your self-interest and interest in your family will manifest as a desire to uphold that political system.
allthenews 9y ago
You dont think that Chinese espionage does not potentially extend to our colleges? You dont think the U.S. is doing at least as much elsewhere? All this talk of collusion with Russia recently doesn't bother you either if it is true that a foreign power could have targeted our culture successfully to the point that they threw an election in their favor? Such sentiment would be naive. Particularly in an authoritarian nation swarming with propaganda. There are plenty of children potentially willing to dedicate themselves to the interests of the party, whether for perceived virtue, or fear of retribution.
- nkurz 9y ago
  You dont think that Chinese espionage does not potentially extend to our colleges? Well, no, I'm not sure what "espionage" would mean here? Does it mean stealing information? Doubtful. Unionizing graduate students? Hard to believe. Thwarting the education of others? Haven't seen it. While the Chinese may be placing people into positions at American universities with the idea that they might one day be useful, I'm not sure what would could as espionage. If anything I'd guess the "operatives" would mostly be keeping track of the activities of other Chinese students, and possibly serving as conduits for more covert operatives, but I'm doubtful they are doing anything that would legally qualify as espionage. You dont think the U.S. is doing at least as much elsewhere? You'd have to be clearer about what the "as much" is, but I'm doubtful the US is putting much effort into putting operatives into academic positions abroad. Probably they want to open channels of communication with people who are already there, but I'm doubtful we're doing anything particularly effective involving "fake" students. And again, what would the goal of this be? All this talk of collusion with Russia recently doesn't bother you Seems worth investigating, but no, nothing I've heard so far bothers me. There are lots of countries that have great interest in affecting/effecting US policies, and I'd presume that Russia would be one of them. I'm doubtful they were particularly effective in influencing an election, though, or even that they were the country with the greatest influence. This is the place where I assume the US is doing much more with regard to other country's elections, possibly with greater impact. Particularly in an authoritarian nation swarming with propaganda. I don't know your politics well enough to know if you mean China, Russia, or the US here? If you point is that there likely exist Chinese students who are willing to do what the Chinese government asks them in return for being allowed to study abroad, then sure. But I'd guess that most of what is being asked is "Learn everything they will teach you and then come home and build a better China", and I think that's a good thing?