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The FBI never changes, does it? I’m not even saying that they’re wrong, but stating it this way is just fodder for bin fires. It would be strange if China and o
by IntronExon 9y ago
The FBI never changes, does it? I’m not even saying that they’re wrong, but stating it this way is just fodder for bin fires. It would be strange if China and others didn’t do this, and strange if the US didn’t do it to them.
- Analemma_ 9y agoHow would you prefer them to state it, then? I mean, with the very next breath you admit that it's almost certainly true. You need to balance reasonable skepticism and dislike of three-letter agencies with the fact that they also do real work in addressing threats from other state actors. EDIT: If you want a take on this from a less law enforcement-y source, try https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2018/01/16/how-china-infiltrated-us-classrooms-216327 https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2018/01/16/how-china.... Politico can hardly be described as paranoid war-hawks.
- IntronExon 9y agoMaybe don’t state it? It’s their job to do something about it, not create diffuse bogeymen for ideologues to play with. What does telling us about a drop in an ocean do for us other than sow suspicion? Unless the danger is real and present, requiring public wariness and intervention, keep intelligence matters within the intelligence community. Edit: That article describes educational institutions run by the Chinese government, rather than the infiltration of US institutions. These strike me as very different topics, especially since one is overt and the other covert.
- nyolfen 9y agothe fbi is law enforcement. behaving as secret police is not a positive alternative.
- IntronExon 9y agoThe FBI’s remit includes domestic counterintelligence.
- walshemj 9y agoit probley wound be better if the usa split the FBI in two 1 A federal police force (with reduced surveillance powers) which would take over the BATF and the currency and uniformed part of the secret service. 2 A separate contra espionage organisation similar to MI5
- Analemma_ 9y agoOh god, don't give them any ideas. We already have an alphabet soup of intelligence agencies (the IC consists of 16 at the moment), don't make it worse.
- walshemj 9y agoI was suggesting that you reduce the number by merging all the policeing type orgs into one FBI, BATF, TSA,DEA etc and merge all of the domestic contra espionage into a new MI5 analog
- Analemma_ 9y ago> Maybe don’t state it? It’s their job to do something about it, You're presenting a curious case here. You want the intelligence community to respond to threats from state actors, but without ever telling the public that's what they're doing? There are two problems with this: 1. Government transparency - I want to know what the FBI is up to. You are advocating more opacity in their operations, for uncertain gain. 2. What if "doing something about it" requires cooperation from the public? The specific issues under discussion is the Confucius Institutes being established at various universities, but these are not illegal and the FBI has no power to get rid of them, nor do I want them to have that power. All they can do is point out the threat and leave the ultimate decision to the university administrators.
- IntronExon 9y ago1. We’re not actually learning about what the FBI is up to, just a vague and unhelpful warning of infiltration. 2. The issue of infiltrating US institutions seems separate from overtly running ChiCom schools on US soil.
- meowface 9y agoYes, of course, but it would also be strange if the FBI didn't warn about it when they identify it happening so that they can decrease the chance of intelligence gatherers getting what they want.
- IntronExon 9y agoI agree with the general principle you’re describing, it I’m unconvinced that it applies in this case. Do you see what I mean? How does this warning empower the public?
- meowface 9y agoPerhaps if you're a researcher at a university and you get an interesting business offer out of the blue in exchange for access to something (maybe data you've gathered), you may be a bit more wary and consider if you're being manipulated by another government's intelligence service.
- IntronExon 9y agoThat’s a good point, and probably good advice regardless of the latest statement from the FBI. Of course if the data is sensitive or controlled, hopefully people are already on that guard.
- deleted 9y ago[deleted]
- gowld 9y agoWhy do I care precisely who is manipulating me?
- meowface 9y agoYou shouldn't, of course. The FBI is just making people aware of this particular campaign.
- PricelessValue 9y agoOf course we do and of course they do. What's interesting is why the sudden "expose" and the media blitz. It's like how we knew the russians and everyone has been taking steroids for decades, but all of a sudden there was a media blitz against russia. Is it just the elites trying to put pressure on china or are we at the beginning stages of a fundamental shift in our relations with china? Have the elites decided on a more antagonistic position against china?
- mr_spothawk 9y agoas a kid people asked me if I was an atheist or not. I learned to tell them I was an Apathet, that I am Apathetic. while I recognize there may be impacts to such a decision, I feel apathetic about the decisions of "the elite". I sometimes imagine that we would all benefit from taking this view.