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The United States use to teach rifles at the grade school level. Basic marksmanship and safety. Then the left came in and decried the violence. We no longer hav

The United States use to teach rifles at the grade school level. Basic marksmanship and safety. Then the left came in and decried the violence. We no longer have that class. At the same time casual gun owners don’t teach their children either. Sad at the loss of life. Perhaps the left is right: we need to allow the government total control since we are all inept.

arethuza 9y ago
I honestly don't see what's wrong with doing it at school (mind you this is possibly an unusual view for the UK) - I was taught to use a metalworking lathe and how to handle concentrated sulfuric acid at a (very modest) high school and I know far more people who handle guns regularly than do either of those.
- soundwave106 9y ago
  Was marksmanship ever part of the mandatory curriculum? I didn't think so even back then. Marksmanship as an extra-curricular activity was probably more common 50 years ago, but from what I can Google, some high schools still have marksmanship clubs (usually under the guise of the JROTC). The biggest issue I can think of with shooting ranges honestly is not "violence" or danger of accidents, but the problem of lead exposure -- a problem that people were a bit less aware of back in "older times", and a particular problem for developing children. Given some reports I see (https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9117191 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9117191) I personally would not be comfortable with a school shooting range that doesn't try to mitigate this risk.
  - abakker 9y ago
    This is manageable with the use of bismuth bullets. I know that in the bay area several shotgun ranges require them.
  - virmundi 9y ago
    Provided someone steps up to help with the cost, Ruger’s ARX avoids led. http://blog.cheaperthandirt.com/ruger-arx-ammunition-wicked-surpassed-performance/ http://blog.cheaperthandirt.com/ruger-arx-ammunition-wicked-...
ghaff 9y ago
It's probably rather uncommon in schools. But I know quite a few parents who teach their children to shoot guns at a local rifle range and take them hunting when they're old enough. Which seems reasonable. Enough people are probably uncomfortable with guns that having it as part of the school curriculum in many areas would be controversial. And there are plenty of opportunities for families that want to teach their children gun safety and marksmanship.
- abakker 9y ago
  American education can be characterized by a gradual removal of all uncomfortable and controversial things from the curriculum. Eventually, all that will be left is the theory of learning, rather than any actual learning. RIP: Woodshop, metal shop, automotive classes, electronics labs, marksmanship, Home economics, cooking...defense against the dark arts...
  - ghaff 9y ago
    I'm not sure how much of that is about controversy though some of it is. I expect part of it is that classroom teaching doesn't require special equipment like a machine shop does. There's also probably an increased emphasis on subjects that are perceived as directly relevant to college admissions testing etc. especially among the demographics of parents who are most likely to have the loudest voices around school curricula. To be clear, I agree with you. High schools in particular should have more hands-on coursework as well as practical skills related to personal finance and statistics.
    - abakker 9y ago
      Yeah, they're not all controversial. I added "uncomfortable" because some of those activities like shop are physically difficult. I can't help but feel that somehow, the dilution of this physical curriculum is somehow a result of the old equality of outcomes vs equality of opportunity debate. It is as if someone perverted the idea that working with your hands as an occupation paid less to meaning that we shouldn't teach it, and therefore everyone will get paid more. I'm not sure that there is a causal link there, but it seems that way to me. Now, we have a dearth of skilled tradesman and we have to hire immigrants with the right skills. (source: have multiple friends/family members in construction, cabinetry, etc.)

arethuza 9y ago

I honestly don't see what's wrong with doing it at school (mind you this is possibly an unusual view for the UK) - I was taught to use a metalworking lathe and how to handle concentrated sulfuric acid at a (very modest) high school and I know far more people who handle guns regularly than do either of those.

soundwave106 9y ago
Was marksmanship ever part of the mandatory curriculum? I didn't think so even back then. Marksmanship as an extra-curricular activity was probably more common 50 years ago, but from what I can Google, some high schools still have marksmanship clubs (usually under the guise of the JROTC). The biggest issue I can think of with shooting ranges honestly is not "violence" or danger of accidents, but the problem of lead exposure -- a problem that people were a bit less aware of back in "older times", and a particular problem for developing children. Given some reports I see (https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9117191 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9117191) I personally would not be comfortable with a school shooting range that doesn't try to mitigate this risk.
- abakker 9y ago
  This is manageable with the use of bismuth bullets. I know that in the bay area several shotgun ranges require them.
- virmundi 9y ago
  Provided someone steps up to help with the cost, Ruger’s ARX avoids led. http://blog.cheaperthandirt.com/ruger-arx-ammunition-wicked-surpassed-performance/ http://blog.cheaperthandirt.com/ruger-arx-ammunition-wicked-...

ghaff 9y ago

It's probably rather uncommon in schools. But I know quite a few parents who teach their children to shoot guns at a local rifle range and take them hunting when they're old enough. Which seems reasonable. Enough people are probably uncomfortable with guns that having it as part of the school curriculum in many areas would be controversial. And there are plenty of opportunities for families that want to teach their children gun safety and marksmanship.

abakker 9y ago
American education can be characterized by a gradual removal of all uncomfortable and controversial things from the curriculum. Eventually, all that will be left is the theory of learning, rather than any actual learning. RIP: Woodshop, metal shop, automotive classes, electronics labs, marksmanship, Home economics, cooking...defense against the dark arts...
- ghaff 9y ago
  I'm not sure how much of that is about controversy though some of it is. I expect part of it is that classroom teaching doesn't require special equipment like a machine shop does. There's also probably an increased emphasis on subjects that are perceived as directly relevant to college admissions testing etc. especially among the demographics of parents who are most likely to have the loudest voices around school curricula. To be clear, I agree with you. High schools in particular should have more hands-on coursework as well as practical skills related to personal finance and statistics.
  - abakker 9y ago
    Yeah, they're not all controversial. I added "uncomfortable" because some of those activities like shop are physically difficult. I can't help but feel that somehow, the dilution of this physical curriculum is somehow a result of the old equality of outcomes vs equality of opportunity debate. It is as if someone perverted the idea that working with your hands as an occupation paid less to meaning that we shouldn't teach it, and therefore everyone will get paid more. I'm not sure that there is a causal link there, but it seems that way to me. Now, we have a dearth of skilled tradesman and we have to hire immigrants with the right skills. (source: have multiple friends/family members in construction, cabinetry, etc.)