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Isn't that the difference between conservative and liberal politics? With the conservative Tories in power this is right up their alley. Disclaimer: Am Swedish

Isn't that the difference between conservative and liberal politics? With the conservative Tories in power this is right up their alley. Disclaimer: Am Swedish so have absolutely no idea

white-flame 9y ago
There's no difference. Look to Facebook and Google in the types of speech that they're working to suppress and how they want to go about it: It's the same thing from the liberal side. Neither "side"'s stereotype actually wants free speech. That's turning into more of a centrist thing, simply by attrition via tribalism of the "two sides" (which itself is a false dichotomy).
toomanybeersies 9y ago
I'm not British, so I'm not fully well versed in UK politics, but as far as I can tell, this has been driven by both Labour and the Tories. Remember, it was under a Labour PM that the UK invaded Iraq. Civil liberties were steadily eroded through a series of anti-terrorism laws during Blair's tenure. Of course, things might be different now that Corbyn is running the Labour party, but it's difficult to undo what has been done. Once power has been gained, the holder is usually very reluctant to let it go. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terrorism_Acts https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terrorism_Acts
gaius 9y ago
You don’t remember Labour’s ID cards and biometric database? Or their expansion of the surveillance state?
- pjc50 9y ago
  Labour were never "liberal", though; this is why trying to map everything onto the "conservative/liberal" dichotomy is a mistake. Old Labour were characterised by a weak state and strong unions; New Labour were characterised by a strong redistributive state that was safe enough for middle-class voters; it remains to be seen what Momentum Labour actually do, if anything.
  - gaius 9y ago
    Yes and no. I don’t think the slate gets wiped clean when a new leader is installed. If the Tories are still carrying the legacy of Thatcher then Labour must held to the same standard with Bliar.
  - toomanybeersies 9y ago
    The problem is that people keep trying to map non-American political systems onto the American political spectrum. Tory vs Labour is a completely different horse race to Republican vs Democrat in the USA. Same goes for most other country's political systems.
timrichard 9y ago
That's the go-to narrative, so not surprising. But a series of Home Secretaries have been hard at work to erode online liberty, from both the major parties. I give you Jack "Boot" Straw : https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2000/jul/31/internet.media https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2000/jul/31/internet....

Isn't that the difference between conservative and liberal politics? With the conservative Tories in power this is right up their alley. Disclaimer: Am Swedish so have absolutely no idea

white-flame 9y ago

There's no difference. Look to Facebook and Google in the types of speech that they're working to suppress and how they want to go about it: It's the same thing from the liberal side. Neither "side"'s stereotype actually wants free speech. That's turning into more of a centrist thing, simply by attrition via tribalism of the "two sides" (which itself is a false dichotomy).

toomanybeersies 9y ago

I'm not British, so I'm not fully well versed in UK politics, but as far as I can tell, this has been driven by both Labour and the Tories. Remember, it was under a Labour PM that the UK invaded Iraq. Civil liberties were steadily eroded through a series of anti-terrorism laws during Blair's tenure. Of course, things might be different now that Corbyn is running the Labour party, but it's difficult to undo what has been done. Once power has been gained, the holder is usually very reluctant to let it go. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terrorism_Acts https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terrorism_Acts

gaius 9y ago

You don’t remember Labour’s ID cards and biometric database? Or their expansion of the surveillance state?

pjc50 9y ago
Labour were never "liberal", though; this is why trying to map everything onto the "conservative/liberal" dichotomy is a mistake. Old Labour were characterised by a weak state and strong unions; New Labour were characterised by a strong redistributive state that was safe enough for middle-class voters; it remains to be seen what Momentum Labour actually do, if anything.
- gaius 9y ago
  Yes and no. I don’t think the slate gets wiped clean when a new leader is installed. If the Tories are still carrying the legacy of Thatcher then Labour must held to the same standard with Bliar.
- toomanybeersies 9y ago
  The problem is that people keep trying to map non-American political systems onto the American political spectrum. Tory vs Labour is a completely different horse race to Republican vs Democrat in the USA. Same goes for most other country's political systems.

timrichard 9y ago

That's the go-to narrative, so not surprising. But a series of Home Secretaries have been hard at work to erode online liberty, from both the major parties. I give you Jack "Boot" Straw : https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2000/jul/31/internet.media https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2000/jul/31/internet....