7 ms·

If the appeal doesn't go Facebook's way, what is the resolution to this? It sounds like they'll just have to update their terms of service to say that you agree

If the appeal doesn't go Facebook's way, what is the resolution to this? It sounds like they'll just have to update their terms of service to say that you agree to allow Facebook to use your data in XYZ ways. Of course, that'll be buried in the fine print and no-one will even notice.

microcolonel 9y ago
> It sounds like they'll just have to update their terms of service to say that you agree to allow Facebook to use your data in XYZ ways. Of course, that'll be buried in the fine print and no-one will even notice. If you read the first paragraph of the article, you'll notice that that is in fact the thing that the court is talking about: the degree of consent created by their terms of service process is deemed insufficient for the disclosure that agreement covers.
- neuland 9y ago
  Ah, I didn't see that when I read it. That's good!
- TomMarius 9y ago
  So they're basically saying "our citizens are so stupid they can't even read properly while becoming a customer of a company based on the other side of the world, and we fine you for their stupidity". Just LOL. I live in the EU and I feel the socialism coming back. I need to get away soon.
  - s73v3r_ 9y ago
    That's a very uncharitable way of looking at things. A different way of phrasing it would be that the EU recognizes the power disparity between Facebook and any individual user, and that an individual user does not have any ability to negotiate with FB, and thus the contract of adhesion that is the ToS is not made in good faith.
    - TomMarius 9y ago
      You know you don't have to use Facebook, right? It's not even like it's the only social network. Facebook is not something you need.
      - s73v3r_ 9y ago
        That's not a reasonable defense, though. Not to mention, it's been shown quite a bit that FB is still gathering information on people who are not members of Facebook.
        TomMarius 9y ago
        How is that not a reasonable defence?
        s73v3r_ 9y ago
        If I attacked everyone who came through my door, saying, "Don't go in that door" is not a defense of my actions.
        deleted 9y ago
        [deleted]
  - e1ven 9y ago
    Your argument seems to imply that people thoroughly read the TOS for every website they use. Even if you do that, most people don’t, regardless of country. “Disclosing” things by putting them in the middle of a document that people don’t read was deemed insufficient. It reminds me of a cute exchange from Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy: Mr Prosser: But, Mr Dent, the plans have been available in the local planning office for the last nine months. Arthur: Oh yes, well as soon as I heard I went straight round to see them, yesterday afternoon. You hadn’t exactly gone out of your way to call attention to them had you? I mean like actually telling anybody or anything. Mr Prosser: But the plans were on display… Arthur: On display? I eventually had to go down to the cellar to find them. Mr Prosser: That’s the display department. Arthur: With a torch. Mr Prosser: The lights had probably gone out. Arthur: So had the stairs. Mr Prosser: But look, you found the notice, didn’t you? Arthur: Yes yes I did. It was on display at the bottom of a locked filing cabinet stuck in a disused lavatory with a sign on the door saying beware of the leopard.
    - TomMarius 9y ago
      No, I just imply that it's their problem if they don't. That's a nice quote but you have to click a button that says 'I've read the TOS' and next to the button is a link leading to the TOS. If you've chosen to not read them, it's entirely your problem.
  - sctb 9y ago
    Please stop breaking the guidelines all over this thread. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

microcolonel 9y ago

> It sounds like they'll just have to update their terms of service to say that you agree to allow Facebook to use your data in XYZ ways. Of course, that'll be buried in the fine print and no-one will even notice. If you read the first paragraph of the article, you'll notice that that is in fact the thing that the court is talking about: the degree of consent created by their terms of service process is deemed insufficient for the disclosure that agreement covers.

neuland 9y ago
Ah, I didn't see that when I read it. That's good!
TomMarius 9y ago
So they're basically saying "our citizens are so stupid they can't even read properly while becoming a customer of a company based on the other side of the world, and we fine you for their stupidity". Just LOL. I live in the EU and I feel the socialism coming back. I need to get away soon.
- s73v3r_ 9y ago
  That's a very uncharitable way of looking at things. A different way of phrasing it would be that the EU recognizes the power disparity between Facebook and any individual user, and that an individual user does not have any ability to negotiate with FB, and thus the contract of adhesion that is the ToS is not made in good faith.
  - TomMarius 9y ago
    You know you don't have to use Facebook, right? It's not even like it's the only social network. Facebook is not something you need.
    - s73v3r_ 9y ago
      That's not a reasonable defense, though. Not to mention, it's been shown quite a bit that FB is still gathering information on people who are not members of Facebook.
      - TomMarius 9y ago
        How is that not a reasonable defence?
        s73v3r_ 9y ago
        If I attacked everyone who came through my door, saying, "Don't go in that door" is not a defense of my actions.
        deleted 9y ago
        [deleted]
- e1ven 9y ago
  Your argument seems to imply that people thoroughly read the TOS for every website they use. Even if you do that, most people don’t, regardless of country. “Disclosing” things by putting them in the middle of a document that people don’t read was deemed insufficient. It reminds me of a cute exchange from Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy: Mr Prosser: But, Mr Dent, the plans have been available in the local planning office for the last nine months. Arthur: Oh yes, well as soon as I heard I went straight round to see them, yesterday afternoon. You hadn’t exactly gone out of your way to call attention to them had you? I mean like actually telling anybody or anything. Mr Prosser: But the plans were on display… Arthur: On display? I eventually had to go down to the cellar to find them. Mr Prosser: That’s the display department. Arthur: With a torch. Mr Prosser: The lights had probably gone out. Arthur: So had the stairs. Mr Prosser: But look, you found the notice, didn’t you? Arthur: Yes yes I did. It was on display at the bottom of a locked filing cabinet stuck in a disused lavatory with a sign on the door saying beware of the leopard.
  - TomMarius 9y ago
    No, I just imply that it's their problem if they don't. That's a nice quote but you have to click a button that says 'I've read the TOS' and next to the button is a link leading to the TOS. If you've chosen to not read them, it's entirely your problem.
- sctb 9y ago
  Please stop breaking the guidelines all over this thread. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html