9 ms·

An absolutely wonderful read. I read three widely recommended books, which diametrically opposed each other on almost everything. So I decided to ignore most of

An absolutely wonderful read. I read three widely recommended books, which diametrically opposed each other on almost everything. So I decided to ignore most of the advice, and rely on friends, family, medical experts, and my own intuition. Anything the books mostly agreed on, I did tend to follow. The three books I read: * The Contented Little Baby - https://www.amazon.co.uk/New-Contented-Little-Baby-Book-ebook/dp/B006K26BPU/ https://www.amazon.co.uk/New-Contented-Little-Baby-Book-eboo... * The Fourth Trimester - https://www.amazon.co.uk/Fourth-Trimester-Understanding-Protecting-Nurturing-ebook/dp/B00AQDIP6M/ https://www.amazon.co.uk/Fourth-Trimester-Understanding-Prot... * The Baby Whisperer - https://www.amazon.co.uk/Secrets-Baby-Whisperer-Connect-Communicate/dp/0091857023/ https://www.amazon.co.uk/Secrets-Baby-Whisperer-Connect-Comm... The most helpful thing I read: "Nobody has been the parent of your child before. What worked for one baby may not work for yours. And remember that every parent develops nostalgia." Also, an elderly lady in my church who had been a teacher said by the age of 8, you can't tell who was breastfed or bottlefed, who had 'baby led weaning', who used natural toys, etc. But you could tell the ones that received a lot of love from their parents.

laumars 9y ago
When we had our first born, advice was to wake the baby for feeding so they get used to regular routines. We did this once and he screamed for the entirety of that day so we just fed him at irregular intervals but tried to ensure he still got the right number of feeds in a day. When we had our second we were told not to wake her. But when she did wake she was so hungry she would have a screaming fit so we learned she preferred to get woken for lunch. Moral of the story: try as hard as you might to generalise child rearing, they'll always find a way to contradict good advice.
- amag 9y ago
  I have two kids and they are about as different as two kids can be. They are truly the inversion of each other in every way. There's no way to generalize, what works/worked on one would never work on the other. The only exception (sounds corny but it's true) is loads of love. But I don't need a book to tell me that, though sometimes a reminder..
- scoggs 9y ago
  This might sound a bit callous (and I know it's more left field than callous but it's my only entry point to this topic) but your story kind of reminded me of a time I visited friends for a weekend at college. A friend of theirs had a new born litter of 1/2 Black Lab 1/2 Pit Bull puppies (the cutest, jet black pups) and my buddy and his girlfriend adopted one, Kujo. Their goal was to get their new puppy used to being and sleeping alone by making sure it slept outside of their bedroom every night. This was the second weekend they had the dog and I, of course, was outside of their bedroom on the floor. The cold carpet. The living room was the only other room besides the bathroom, which we all wanted to keep dog free for everyone's convenience, in their small college apartment. I was told to try not sleep / cuddle with the dog overnight, but not sternly. I'm a light sleeper as it is and after about 15 minutes of listening to the little guy cry and whimper I caved in figuring one night of sleeping cuddled up with me couldn't ruin a K-9's entire life of attachment. Plus I was on the floor and as you can tell I'm soft as it comes with animals and children. I'll never know whether my softness that night ruined Kujo's sense of attachment but I will tell you right now, as someone who has always wanted kids I can't imagine I'll be able to keep my own flesh and blood at a distance while they are crying and calling out all night long :*(. I have so much respect and am in awe of parents of all types. Keep kicking butt!
  - laumars 9y ago
    It's not easy sometimes but you do learn the difference between kids crying because they're in distress and crying because they're just being stubborn. The real difficulty is when they're distressed but "tough love" is exactly whats needed (eg you're example of getting them to sleep in their own bed). What I struggle the most with is when they actually put a logical argument forward to get their own way. My eldest is not long 4 and he has already been putting some pretty intelligent counter arguments for why he should get his own way for about two years now. Sometimes I cave even if I know he is just arguing because his points are so well formed that I simply cannot argue back (plus I never want to stifle a kids ability to examine and deconstruct the world). My wife often calls me a big softy for that. Ultimately though, my wife and I compliment each other in different ways so where I struggle with parenting she excels; and visa versa. I don't even know how single parents cope because I know for a fact I wouldn't.
- mcv 9y ago
  This is why advice can still be useful, but you need to understand that every piece of advice only works for some kids, and not all. You still need to find what works for you, but it may help to have some idea of what the options are.
emilecantin 9y ago
As a father of four girls ranging from 8 years to three months old, I have to agree with that elderly lady. My daughters are all very different persons, with their own personalities, likes and interests. There's very little I could do to change who they fundamentally are, even if I wanted to. I also believe that as long as you love your children (which is very easy to do), and provide them with a safe environment where they can feel empowered to try things (a bit harder, but still very doable), they'll turn out fine. There's this trend in parenting nowadays, where we're all pursuing perfection via different techniques / philosophies, but anything involving living things, especially humans, is inherently messy / imperfect. Raising children is no exception.
- amag 9y ago
  Exactly, forego all "techniques" and just make them feel loved no matter what. Then let them discover the world, pursue their own interests. Take a step back and don't let your fears hold them back. Challenge and push them gently when their fears hold them back. They won't be perfect, they were raised by imperfect persons after all, but with enough love they'll be ok.
- tremendulo 9y ago
  >we're all pursuing perfection via different techniques Yes, while often getting fundamentals wrong, e.g. there are millions of two year olds in day care.
  - lovemenot 9y ago
    I am not an expert but isn't that just the kind of dogmatic viewpoint which the article suggests has little value. You may believe day-care for two year-olds is fundamentally wrong, but there's little empirical evidence to show that children raised in different ways have different outcomes. At least you should indicate why you believe those millions are being raised wrongly, rather than merely assert it as fact.
    - tremendulo 9y ago
      Empirical evidence can't decide on moral issues. To complicate matters further most moral stuff can't be explained very well. For example, 'murder is wrong' is an uncontroversial moral fact which is both unfalsifiable and hard to explain. In simple everyday terms I'd say small children need love and attention like a plant needs water. They can't get these reliably at day care. But most of us already know this.
peeky 9y ago
Exactly! Beautifully put. The most insidious thing about a lot of these books is the way they can undermine your confidence as a parent at exactly the time you're most vulnerable. Look at these guarantees, look at all these testimonials, look how we use the word 'science' on every page; if your baby isn't sleeping then you're obviously still doing it wrong, you're a bad parent, it's all your fault. I'm pretty sure it was The Baby Whisperer that nearly drove my wife to a breakdown before we agreed to bin it.
- mcv 9y ago
  > if your baby isn't sleeping then you're obviously still doing it wrong, you're a bad parent, it's all your fault. I would strongly hope that parents would draw the conclusion that the book is wrong. With so many contradictory books, some are bound to be wrong, so if a book doesn't work, it must be one of the wrong ones. Try another one to see if it works, or maybe try your own ideas and see if those work. Parenting is mostly experimentation.
atourgates 9y ago
Stellar advice. I likewise didn't find any perfect instruction manual for keeping a baby healthy and alive, but I did find the process of reading and considering the advice they gave to be helpful in forming our own processes and opinions. I'd recommend that any prospective parent take some time to read several baby books from conflicting perspectives, to give you the opportunity to be intentional about your parenting style. Watching other parents is also really really helpful if you have the chance. More often from a "we need to make sure we never ever do that" perspective than anything else.
DenisM 9y ago
If the answers were all diverging, perhaps the questions themselves could be of help? Gives you things to watch out for. Were the questions answered by the books similar enough?
bby 9y ago
I can usually spot breastfed with 80% accuracy after meeting a child for over 5 minutes.

laumars 9y ago

When we had our first born, advice was to wake the baby for feeding so they get used to regular routines. We did this once and he screamed for the entirety of that day so we just fed him at irregular intervals but tried to ensure he still got the right number of feeds in a day. When we had our second we were told not to wake her. But when she did wake she was so hungry she would have a screaming fit so we learned she preferred to get woken for lunch. Moral of the story: try as hard as you might to generalise child rearing, they'll always find a way to contradict good advice.

amag 9y ago
I have two kids and they are about as different as two kids can be. They are truly the inversion of each other in every way. There's no way to generalize, what works/worked on one would never work on the other. The only exception (sounds corny but it's true) is loads of love. But I don't need a book to tell me that, though sometimes a reminder..
scoggs 9y ago
This might sound a bit callous (and I know it's more left field than callous but it's my only entry point to this topic) but your story kind of reminded me of a time I visited friends for a weekend at college. A friend of theirs had a new born litter of 1/2 Black Lab 1/2 Pit Bull puppies (the cutest, jet black pups) and my buddy and his girlfriend adopted one, Kujo. Their goal was to get their new puppy used to being and sleeping alone by making sure it slept outside of their bedroom every night. This was the second weekend they had the dog and I, of course, was outside of their bedroom on the floor. The cold carpet. The living room was the only other room besides the bathroom, which we all wanted to keep dog free for everyone's convenience, in their small college apartment. I was told to try not sleep / cuddle with the dog overnight, but not sternly. I'm a light sleeper as it is and after about 15 minutes of listening to the little guy cry and whimper I caved in figuring one night of sleeping cuddled up with me couldn't ruin a K-9's entire life of attachment. Plus I was on the floor and as you can tell I'm soft as it comes with animals and children. I'll never know whether my softness that night ruined Kujo's sense of attachment but I will tell you right now, as someone who has always wanted kids I can't imagine I'll be able to keep my own flesh and blood at a distance while they are crying and calling out all night long :*(. I have so much respect and am in awe of parents of all types. Keep kicking butt!
- laumars 9y ago
  It's not easy sometimes but you do learn the difference between kids crying because they're in distress and crying because they're just being stubborn. The real difficulty is when they're distressed but "tough love" is exactly whats needed (eg you're example of getting them to sleep in their own bed). What I struggle the most with is when they actually put a logical argument forward to get their own way. My eldest is not long 4 and he has already been putting some pretty intelligent counter arguments for why he should get his own way for about two years now. Sometimes I cave even if I know he is just arguing because his points are so well formed that I simply cannot argue back (plus I never want to stifle a kids ability to examine and deconstruct the world). My wife often calls me a big softy for that. Ultimately though, my wife and I compliment each other in different ways so where I struggle with parenting she excels; and visa versa. I don't even know how single parents cope because I know for a fact I wouldn't.
mcv 9y ago
This is why advice can still be useful, but you need to understand that every piece of advice only works for some kids, and not all. You still need to find what works for you, but it may help to have some idea of what the options are.

emilecantin 9y ago

As a father of four girls ranging from 8 years to three months old, I have to agree with that elderly lady. My daughters are all very different persons, with their own personalities, likes and interests. There's very little I could do to change who they fundamentally are, even if I wanted to. I also believe that as long as you love your children (which is very easy to do), and provide them with a safe environment where they can feel empowered to try things (a bit harder, but still very doable), they'll turn out fine. There's this trend in parenting nowadays, where we're all pursuing perfection via different techniques / philosophies, but anything involving living things, especially humans, is inherently messy / imperfect. Raising children is no exception.

amag 9y ago
Exactly, forego all "techniques" and just make them feel loved no matter what. Then let them discover the world, pursue their own interests. Take a step back and don't let your fears hold them back. Challenge and push them gently when their fears hold them back. They won't be perfect, they were raised by imperfect persons after all, but with enough love they'll be ok.
tremendulo 9y ago
>we're all pursuing perfection via different techniques Yes, while often getting fundamentals wrong, e.g. there are millions of two year olds in day care.
- lovemenot 9y ago
  I am not an expert but isn't that just the kind of dogmatic viewpoint which the article suggests has little value. You may believe day-care for two year-olds is fundamentally wrong, but there's little empirical evidence to show that children raised in different ways have different outcomes. At least you should indicate why you believe those millions are being raised wrongly, rather than merely assert it as fact.
  - tremendulo 9y ago
    Empirical evidence can't decide on moral issues. To complicate matters further most moral stuff can't be explained very well. For example, 'murder is wrong' is an uncontroversial moral fact which is both unfalsifiable and hard to explain. In simple everyday terms I'd say small children need love and attention like a plant needs water. They can't get these reliably at day care. But most of us already know this.

peeky 9y ago

Exactly! Beautifully put. The most insidious thing about a lot of these books is the way they can undermine your confidence as a parent at exactly the time you're most vulnerable. Look at these guarantees, look at all these testimonials, look how we use the word 'science' on every page; if your baby isn't sleeping then you're obviously still doing it wrong, you're a bad parent, it's all your fault. I'm pretty sure it was The Baby Whisperer that nearly drove my wife to a breakdown before we agreed to bin it.

mcv 9y ago
> if your baby isn't sleeping then you're obviously still doing it wrong, you're a bad parent, it's all your fault. I would strongly hope that parents would draw the conclusion that the book is wrong. With so many contradictory books, some are bound to be wrong, so if a book doesn't work, it must be one of the wrong ones. Try another one to see if it works, or maybe try your own ideas and see if those work. Parenting is mostly experimentation.

atourgates 9y ago

Stellar advice. I likewise didn't find any perfect instruction manual for keeping a baby healthy and alive, but I did find the process of reading and considering the advice they gave to be helpful in forming our own processes and opinions. I'd recommend that any prospective parent take some time to read several baby books from conflicting perspectives, to give you the opportunity to be intentional about your parenting style. Watching other parents is also really really helpful if you have the chance. More often from a "we need to make sure we never ever do that" perspective than anything else.

DenisM 9y ago

If the answers were all diverging, perhaps the questions themselves could be of help? Gives you things to watch out for. Were the questions answered by the books similar enough?

bby 9y ago

I can usually spot breastfed with 80% accuracy after meeting a child for over 5 minutes.