3 ms·

I'm a bit younger on the age range at 23, and taking some time out of school since my grades and finances weren't quite where I wanted them to be. Would you say

I'm a bit younger on the age range at 23, and taking some time out of school since my grades and finances weren't quite where I wanted them to be. Would you say a person who has a handful of relevant Coursera certificates and does well on an interview would be able to compete against a degree holder who also did above average? For your case of staying current in newer tech I can see the market reason for taking it. People like Knuth who're well into their 70's still seem to find ways to remain relevant as well. What is the "Caoursel" you're referring to?

jcadam 9y ago
It's a reference to the 70s sci-fi classic Logan's Run :) Also, I've worked with non-degree holders. If they were good, they managed to find employment. Though, often employers will use the lack of a degree as an excuse to pay less, which isn't right.
- kregasaurusrex 9y ago
  Oddly enough, I was thinking about that on a bus ride today. How it's both normalized to value non-degreeholders less and for compensation to plateau at a lower rate. While I do think there's a skills gap that exists, having at least one degree seems entry-level for a lot of people nowadays. And Logan's Run looks like a neat movie, in my city we have a monthly mash-up of old films that play at an independent theater, so I'll check it out sometime.
fma 9y ago
It would definitely depend where you apply. If you have no experience and no degree, you should have a GitHub to backup your claims - and apply to companies who would dig through that. There are certain companies and industries who would not touch you with a 10 foot poll w/o a degree, but hire a degree holder who sits there and looks pretty (i.e. government contractors, consulting). In reply to your Knuth comment...Tom Brady is 40 years old but you're not going to find many football players who are 40 and still playing in Super Bowls.
bitL 9y ago
After 40 you'd be actively managed out by a company, even if you built their business from the scratch. You see it happening all the time, once you start thinking you should now reap rewards of your hard work, you'll be shown the door. Better start your own company and fight for life than to end up 40-year old unemployed burned out developer.
- tinymollusk 9y ago
  ^ This is one person's opinion that reflects their own experience. I am a 35 year old who has done development, and may do it again in the future. I have kept my skillset updated by taking several AI courses during a sabbatical. If you are competing against a group that competes for roles that select for what you think is silly, you'll never win. This does not describe most startups; it may be an indicator of bad startups. There is age discrimination, for sure. In the startup cohort study of the future, I am quite confident those exhibiting this discrimination will not be on the successful side. Younger devs focus on their skills. Older devs focus on the value they bring to the company. Companies that focus on the latter will do better. YMMV, we live in a probabilistic world.
  - bitL 9y ago
    It's not my experience, it's my observations on people that graduated MIT and similar top schools, created awesome things and got the boot from companies they built without any remorse from management that sensed more money to them. At 35 you are likely at the peak of your abilities and just starting decline in your employability. Try to apply to some companies online for the fun of it (e.g. practice current crop of interviews) and report back on how many want to talk to you and how many want to give you more $ than you are earning right now.

jcadam 9y ago

It's a reference to the 70s sci-fi classic Logan's Run :) Also, I've worked with non-degree holders. If they were good, they managed to find employment. Though, often employers will use the lack of a degree as an excuse to pay less, which isn't right.

kregasaurusrex 9y ago
Oddly enough, I was thinking about that on a bus ride today. How it's both normalized to value non-degreeholders less and for compensation to plateau at a lower rate. While I do think there's a skills gap that exists, having at least one degree seems entry-level for a lot of people nowadays. And Logan's Run looks like a neat movie, in my city we have a monthly mash-up of old films that play at an independent theater, so I'll check it out sometime.

fma 9y ago

It would definitely depend where you apply. If you have no experience and no degree, you should have a GitHub to backup your claims - and apply to companies who would dig through that. There are certain companies and industries who would not touch you with a 10 foot poll w/o a degree, but hire a degree holder who sits there and looks pretty (i.e. government contractors, consulting). In reply to your Knuth comment...Tom Brady is 40 years old but you're not going to find many football players who are 40 and still playing in Super Bowls.

bitL 9y ago

After 40 you'd be actively managed out by a company, even if you built their business from the scratch. You see it happening all the time, once you start thinking you should now reap rewards of your hard work, you'll be shown the door. Better start your own company and fight for life than to end up 40-year old unemployed burned out developer.

tinymollusk 9y ago
^ This is one person's opinion that reflects their own experience. I am a 35 year old who has done development, and may do it again in the future. I have kept my skillset updated by taking several AI courses during a sabbatical. If you are competing against a group that competes for roles that select for what you think is silly, you'll never win. This does not describe most startups; it may be an indicator of bad startups. There is age discrimination, for sure. In the startup cohort study of the future, I am quite confident those exhibiting this discrimination will not be on the successful side. Younger devs focus on their skills. Older devs focus on the value they bring to the company. Companies that focus on the latter will do better. YMMV, we live in a probabilistic world.
- bitL 9y ago
  It's not my experience, it's my observations on people that graduated MIT and similar top schools, created awesome things and got the boot from companies they built without any remorse from management that sensed more money to them. At 35 you are likely at the peak of your abilities and just starting decline in your employability. Try to apply to some companies online for the fun of it (e.g. practice current crop of interviews) and report back on how many want to talk to you and how many want to give you more $ than you are earning right now.