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Eh, arguably Star Trek has much less sophisticated technology than The Culture, especially when it comes to AI: remember, Data was very unique, and he’s absolut

Eh, arguably Star Trek has much less sophisticated technology than The Culture, especially when it comes to AI: remember, Data was very unique, and he’s absolutely nothing compared to a Mind.

philipkglass 9y ago
In broad strokes: both have life independent from planetary surfaces, strong AI, FTL communications and travel, teleportation, and extremely cheap and abundant energy. The Federation has time travel over the Culture, but less impressive AI and comparatively abysmal biomedical technology. The latter two weaknesses are, IMO, more a result of extreme technological conservatism in the Federation than any universal technological ceiling being lower in the Trek setting. In TNG we see that the computer can faithfully emulate human intelligences on the Holodeck, including human geniuses, while maintaining its "ordinary" ship duties as well. (At least I seem to recall Barclay consulting a virtual Einstein in the Holodeck when an alien probe turned Barclay into a supergenius in "The Nth Degree.") So they've got strong AI for entertainment. And for medical care, according to Voyager. Run it faster than realtime and I'd guess it's already weakly superhuman, Data-or-better. Then keep iterating from there, like the Culture ancestors did for generations of AI before the full-fledged Minds came about. I'm not going to argue that Trek has anything close to Minds, but it seems like the Federation already has the ancestors of Minds, lacking mostly the willingness to let them develop further. The even weirder question, when I keep thinking about it, is why none of the other major factions in Star Trek were less reactionary about e.g. ubiquitous AI or life extension. It seems like the Vulcans, Romulans, or somebody would have already been willing to end aging and/or adapt transporter technology to make immortal backups of individuals.
- qbrass 9y ago
  The Federation are basically space Amish that don't see their current technology as being advanced. Starting in TNG, they literally fight technology incarnate to keep from losing their souls. And who brought them to that fight? None other than a people with ultra-advanced technology who appeared to them as gods.
  - effie 9y ago
    Interesting observation. My impression was different - they do not reject or fight technology itself - they just take it as common, uninteresting part of life, which makes sense if we assume that at their time, Federation technology got into highly evolved saturated state where it did not change much for decades. The real focus of TNG is on people, exploring the new places, human relations, prejudices, ethics, that kind of stuff. It is really about an optimistic vision of the future of the western society. The hi-tech environment greatest role was that it attracted geek viewers and made those difficult topics easier to get exposed to.

Eh, arguably Star Trek has much less sophisticated technology than The Culture, especially when it comes to AI: remember, Data was very unique, and he’s absolutely nothing compared to a Mind.

philipkglass 9y ago

In broad strokes: both have life independent from planetary surfaces, strong AI, FTL communications and travel, teleportation, and extremely cheap and abundant energy. The Federation has time travel over the Culture, but less impressive AI and comparatively abysmal biomedical technology. The latter two weaknesses are, IMO, more a result of extreme technological conservatism in the Federation than any universal technological ceiling being lower in the Trek setting. In TNG we see that the computer can faithfully emulate human intelligences on the Holodeck, including human geniuses, while maintaining its "ordinary" ship duties as well. (At least I seem to recall Barclay consulting a virtual Einstein in the Holodeck when an alien probe turned Barclay into a supergenius in "The Nth Degree.") So they've got strong AI for entertainment. And for medical care, according to Voyager. Run it faster than realtime and I'd guess it's already weakly superhuman, Data-or-better. Then keep iterating from there, like the Culture ancestors did for generations of AI before the full-fledged Minds came about. I'm not going to argue that Trek has anything close to Minds, but it seems like the Federation already has the ancestors of Minds, lacking mostly the willingness to let them develop further. The even weirder question, when I keep thinking about it, is why none of the other major factions in Star Trek were less reactionary about e.g. ubiquitous AI or life extension. It seems like the Vulcans, Romulans, or somebody would have already been willing to end aging and/or adapt transporter technology to make immortal backups of individuals.

qbrass 9y ago
The Federation are basically space Amish that don't see their current technology as being advanced. Starting in TNG, they literally fight technology incarnate to keep from losing their souls. And who brought them to that fight? None other than a people with ultra-advanced technology who appeared to them as gods.
- effie 9y ago
  Interesting observation. My impression was different - they do not reject or fight technology itself - they just take it as common, uninteresting part of life, which makes sense if we assume that at their time, Federation technology got into highly evolved saturated state where it did not change much for decades. The real focus of TNG is on people, exploring the new places, human relations, prejudices, ethics, that kind of stuff. It is really about an optimistic vision of the future of the western society. The hi-tech environment greatest role was that it attracted geek viewers and made those difficult topics easier to get exposed to.