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You have no idea how many hours these people practice, when they began playing, their practice methods, and so on. And you’re comparing them to other random pe

by freyir 9y ago

You have no idea how many hours these people practice, when they began playing, their practice methods, and so on. And you’re comparing them to other random people on Twitch, who might be casual players just noodling around. So what are we supposed to deduce from this?

fwsgonzo 9y ago
My point was only about how there are great minds out there who clearly are not like the rest, whether it be music or ability to perform in another professional capacity. There are Dota2 players who have played the game all their lives, yet not achieved "much" compared to young kids who explode into the scene only to remain in a higher tier. This https://dota.rgp.io/mmr/ https://dota.rgp.io/mmr/ shows that in that particular game only the 99.95 percentile is pro-level. I've personally played an instrument since I was 7 and while I was playing every day until I was 18 that didn't automatically make me able to produce good music that gives people goosebumps. But I've met plenty who can, without much practice. In fact their earlier music had an unrefined thing about it that made it unique. They were just good, I guess. Sorry if that doesn't make any sense.
- freyir 9y ago
  It does make sense. Generally, I agree that some people clearly have a lot of raw talent. But also I think we’re very attracted to this idea of the “natural,” who becomes a virtuoso almost effortlessly. In my experience, most people who reach the very highest skill levels have both raw talent and a tremendous work ethic. And a lot of people who show early promise never reach their potential because they won’t put in the time. Sometimes the distinction between talent and effort isn’t even clear. There’s a documentary called Magnus about the chess champion Magnus Carlsen. It shows him as a kid, thinking about chess from the moment he wakes up to the moment he sleeps (and he probably dreamt about chess too). While others are playing, he’s staring off into space thinking about chess. That is some kind of talent, the ability to maintain complete focus like that over many years. I’d bet some of these Dota2 players in the top 0.5% spend an extreme amount of time playing or thinking about the game.
  - dkersten 9y ago
    I remember reading some interview or other with some pro gamers who said they basically practiced for 15 houars a day, every day.

by freyir 9y ago

fwsgonzo 9y ago

My point was only about how there are great minds out there who clearly are not like the rest, whether it be music or ability to perform in another professional capacity. There are Dota2 players who have played the game all their lives, yet not achieved "much" compared to young kids who explode into the scene only to remain in a higher tier. This https://dota.rgp.io/mmr/ https://dota.rgp.io/mmr/ shows that in that particular game only the 99.95 percentile is pro-level. I've personally played an instrument since I was 7 and while I was playing every day until I was 18 that didn't automatically make me able to produce good music that gives people goosebumps. But I've met plenty who can, without much practice. In fact their earlier music had an unrefined thing about it that made it unique. They were just good, I guess. Sorry if that doesn't make any sense.

freyir 9y ago
It does make sense. Generally, I agree that some people clearly have a lot of raw talent. But also I think we’re very attracted to this idea of the “natural,” who becomes a virtuoso almost effortlessly. In my experience, most people who reach the very highest skill levels have both raw talent and a tremendous work ethic. And a lot of people who show early promise never reach their potential because they won’t put in the time. Sometimes the distinction between talent and effort isn’t even clear. There’s a documentary called Magnus about the chess champion Magnus Carlsen. It shows him as a kid, thinking about chess from the moment he wakes up to the moment he sleeps (and he probably dreamt about chess too). While others are playing, he’s staring off into space thinking about chess. That is some kind of talent, the ability to maintain complete focus like that over many years. I’d bet some of these Dota2 players in the top 0.5% spend an extreme amount of time playing or thinking about the game.
- dkersten 9y ago
  I remember reading some interview or other with some pro gamers who said they basically practiced for 15 houars a day, every day.