4 ms·

Regime change is currently on the table. In the event of further economic collapse. What Would a U.S. Intervention in Venezuela Look Like? https://www.foreign

by indescions_2018 9y ago

Regime change is currently on the table. In the event of further economic collapse. What Would a U.S. Intervention in Venezuela Look Like? https://www.foreignaffairs.com/articles/venezuela/2017-11-08/what-would-us-intervention-venezuela-look https://www.foreignaffairs.com/articles/venezuela/2017-11-08...

StanislavPetrov 9y ago
Regime change has been underway for years. It always starts with sanctions to choke off and destabilize a country. Then the instability is used as a (poor) excuse to invade. The same playbook is invariably used against every country that opposes US/NATO global hegemony. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/dec/12/amid-violence-against-protesters-venezuela-to-face-us-sanctions https://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/dec/12/amid-violence-... When one of our client states uses violence against protesters (Egypt, Israel, Saudi Arabia, ect) we supply them with Apache attack helicopters and billions of dollars in subsidies. When the same behavior is exhibited by a state that isn't under our control, sanctions and war are always soon to follow. https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-egypt-apaches/u-s-to-deliver-apache-helicopters-to-egypt-relaxing-hold-on-aid-idUSBREA3M03L20140423 https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-egypt-apaches/u-s-to-...
- aclsid 9y ago
  In this case I can assure you the US had little to do with the economic collapse. The reason why the economy went down the drain was because of an extreme currency control. Just months after Maduro got ahold of power, he got rid of the only mechanism that existed to buy foreign currency legally. So what happened is that people had to resort to buy US dollars at black market rates. That caused shortages, inflation, etc. Then they had the brilliant idea to enforce price controls on a lot of goods, which only served to ensure that nobody wanted to produce or trade said good. US/EU sanctions only came recently and are targeted at individuals, so no, this mess is caused by the Venezuelan government itself.
  - StanislavPetrov 9y ago
    Sorry this is false. Certainly their poor economic policies helped lead to the mess they are in but its not accurate to say that US/EU policies and sanctions didn't play a significant role. Nor is it accurate to say that these sanctions "came recently" or were targeted only at individuals. We have been sanctioned the entire country of Venezuela for well over a decade. https://www.reuters.com/article/us-iran-usa-sanctions/u-s-sanctions-venezuelan-oil-giant-for-iran-trade-idUSTRE74N47R20110524 https://www.reuters.com/article/us-iran-usa-sanctions/u-s-sa...
    - rtpg 9y ago
      the second paragrph of this article says that the sanctions are largely symbolic? If so, how does that lead to economic collapse?
kra34 9y ago
Do we know if Venezuelans' use social media? I've got an idea...
armenarmen 9y ago
US intervention seems like an option. Especially given the fact that Venezuela is looking to sell oil for Yuan[https://www.forbes.com/sites/ellenrwald/2017/09/15/venezuelas-latest-currency-decision-shows-desperation/#5f8fd5a53094 https://www.forbes.com/sites/ellenrwald/2017/09/15/venezuela...] a move that has been the strongest predictor of US intervention in the past 2 decades.
- rtpg 9y ago
  What are the other cases of US intervention in this style? I can understand the consternation at some level, but has something happened in the past 2 decades that I just missed?
  - armenarmen 9y ago
    Hussein began selling oil for Euros shortly before the US invaded in 2003, Gadaffi was looking to sell oil for gold shortly before the US decided 'more freedom' was in order. Might just be a happy coincidence, but the petrodollar is a huge part of the US Dollar's value.
    - nathanaldensr 9y ago
      I'm not sure why you're being downvoted for stating facts. This is a well-known theory for when the US government chooses to intervene in other countries' affairs.
      - perl4ever 9y ago
        Since anyone can trade dollars for Euros for other currencies for gold any time they like, it makes no sense for the US to care what someone sells oil for. It's as silly as claiming the US would invade someone for using metric. If you want to buy something outside the US, you generally can't use dollars, and obviously the US doesn't try to prevent that, nor could it.
      - Viliam1234 9y ago
        I bought a bottle of olive oil recently in a supermarket, and paid with Euros. I expect the American imperialists to bomb the shop soon. (just kidding)

StanislavPetrov 9y ago

Regime change has been underway for years. It always starts with sanctions to choke off and destabilize a country. Then the instability is used as a (poor) excuse to invade. The same playbook is invariably used against every country that opposes US/NATO global hegemony. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/dec/12/amid-violence-against-protesters-venezuela-to-face-us-sanctions https://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/dec/12/amid-violence-... When one of our client states uses violence against protesters (Egypt, Israel, Saudi Arabia, ect) we supply them with Apache attack helicopters and billions of dollars in subsidies. When the same behavior is exhibited by a state that isn't under our control, sanctions and war are always soon to follow. https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-egypt-apaches/u-s-to-deliver-apache-helicopters-to-egypt-relaxing-hold-on-aid-idUSBREA3M03L20140423 https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-egypt-apaches/u-s-to-...

aclsid 9y ago
In this case I can assure you the US had little to do with the economic collapse. The reason why the economy went down the drain was because of an extreme currency control. Just months after Maduro got ahold of power, he got rid of the only mechanism that existed to buy foreign currency legally. So what happened is that people had to resort to buy US dollars at black market rates. That caused shortages, inflation, etc. Then they had the brilliant idea to enforce price controls on a lot of goods, which only served to ensure that nobody wanted to produce or trade said good. US/EU sanctions only came recently and are targeted at individuals, so no, this mess is caused by the Venezuelan government itself.
- StanislavPetrov 9y ago
  Sorry this is false. Certainly their poor economic policies helped lead to the mess they are in but its not accurate to say that US/EU policies and sanctions didn't play a significant role. Nor is it accurate to say that these sanctions "came recently" or were targeted only at individuals. We have been sanctioned the entire country of Venezuela for well over a decade. https://www.reuters.com/article/us-iran-usa-sanctions/u-s-sanctions-venezuelan-oil-giant-for-iran-trade-idUSTRE74N47R20110524 https://www.reuters.com/article/us-iran-usa-sanctions/u-s-sa...
  - rtpg 9y ago
    the second paragrph of this article says that the sanctions are largely symbolic? If so, how does that lead to economic collapse?

kra34 9y ago

Do we know if Venezuelans' use social media? I've got an idea...

armenarmen 9y ago

US intervention seems like an option. Especially given the fact that Venezuela is looking to sell oil for Yuan[https://www.forbes.com/sites/ellenrwald/2017/09/15/venezuelas-latest-currency-decision-shows-desperation/#5f8fd5a53094 https://www.forbes.com/sites/ellenrwald/2017/09/15/venezuela...] a move that has been the strongest predictor of US intervention in the past 2 decades.

rtpg 9y ago
What are the other cases of US intervention in this style? I can understand the consternation at some level, but has something happened in the past 2 decades that I just missed?
- armenarmen 9y ago
  Hussein began selling oil for Euros shortly before the US invaded in 2003, Gadaffi was looking to sell oil for gold shortly before the US decided 'more freedom' was in order. Might just be a happy coincidence, but the petrodollar is a huge part of the US Dollar's value.
  - nathanaldensr 9y ago
    I'm not sure why you're being downvoted for stating facts. This is a well-known theory for when the US government chooses to intervene in other countries' affairs.
    - perl4ever 9y ago
      Since anyone can trade dollars for Euros for other currencies for gold any time they like, it makes no sense for the US to care what someone sells oil for. It's as silly as claiming the US would invade someone for using metric. If you want to buy something outside the US, you generally can't use dollars, and obviously the US doesn't try to prevent that, nor could it.
    - Viliam1234 9y ago
      I bought a bottle of olive oil recently in a supermarket, and paid with Euros. I expect the American imperialists to bomb the shop soon. (just kidding)