4 ms·

FYI most game network servers tick the network at 10-12Hz(although the internal sim may run higher). We generally didn't go higher than 10Hz since you'd start

FYI most game network servers tick the network at 10-12Hz(although the internal sim may run higher). We generally didn't go higher than 10Hz since you'd start saturating lower end connections and any well written game will be good at reconciling state via dead-reckoning. You have to handle 100ms+ spikes anyway so it doesn't make sense to run the network super-fast.

troncjb 9y ago
What do you mean by "game network servers tick the network"? Like data going server -> client ?
AlphaSite 9y ago
Most competitive games go well above 10Hz ticks, OW does it, CSGO does it (I don't really know the tick-rates of other games but when it matters, so no comment there, but there is an important area for it). OW just has a restricted rate option for low bandwidth connections (added when they went from 23 -> 61 Hz).
- vvanders 9y ago
  So that might be the case for LAN games, generally internet tends to stay lower. Valve for instance recommends 13Hz[1] for Source(CSGO): > // 60 for updaterate is LAN ONLY use 13 for internet > // 20 is default but will cut the maxplayers you can handle in 1/2 > // for SRCDS Servers use 30 - you might be able to use 20 > // sv_maxupdaterate 60 > sv_maxupdaterate 13 Like I said, depending on how good your potential-vis code is you may be able to go higher but you risk saturating your client links and most game netcode doesn't handle congestion nicely. My info is a little out of date(2-3 years) but back then we had to keep data rates below 20kb/sec(and ideally 10kb/sec) if you wanted low jitter across the link. [1] https://support.steampowered.com/kb_article.php?ref=5386-HMJI-5162 https://support.steampowered.com/kb_article.php?ref=5386-HMJ...
  - learc83 9y ago
    >So that might be the case for LAN games Overwatch has a 63Hz tick rate over the internet.
    - vvanders 9y ago
      And they handle congestion cleanly[1] which is one of the things I predicated you need if you didn't do 10-13Hz(along with smarter vis sets). Every game is going to be unique and gameplay structure has a huge impact on your data rate. We had games back in '97 like Subspace[1] that handled hundreds of players in the days of dial-up and 200ms+ pings. Generally if your data rate per-link goes above 10kb/sec you'll start to see degradation of jitter across your userbase. There's smart ways to handle that but if you want to do a fixed-tick you run up against that limit really quickly. [edit] Other games will do smart things to keep skill high and tick rates low. CS(but not CS:Go that I know of) used to famously rewind time based on your latency so your view of the world was accurate, but lead to fun behaviors like rubberbanding as you got shot around a corner(due to movement speed slowing down at that past point in time and the game having to reconcile it with the current timestamp). [1] http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2016-08-12-looks-like-blizzard-silently-improved-overwatch-server-tick-rate http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2016-08-12-looks-like-bliz... [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SubSpace_(video_game) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SubSpace_(video_game)
      - bcassedy 9y ago
        Man Subspace/Continuum was such a great game. I do recall issues with packet loss, but in general the game functioned really well even on my 33.6kbps modem with hundreds of players and pretty frenetic gameplay. It's not until you mentioned it that I realize how amazing that feat is.
        vvanders 9y ago
        Oh yeah, I love to hold up Subspace as a perfect example of why games is so cross-discipline driven. For networked games building design about predicting where someone will be means that frame-to-frame latency almost doesn't matter. The Newtonian physics of that game plays into it perfectly leading to a something that works over primitive modems. Even FPS games to a large degree are about predicting/leading the positions of the other players. Compare that to say, fighting games which are very reactionary and very hard to run over any latent connection without some seriously complicated netcode involving time rewinding.
gsich 9y ago
Only PUBG and Fortnite have such shitty tickrates.

troncjb 9y ago

What do you mean by "game network servers tick the network"? Like data going server -> client ?

AlphaSite 9y ago

Most competitive games go well above 10Hz ticks, OW does it, CSGO does it (I don't really know the tick-rates of other games but when it matters, so no comment there, but there is an important area for it). OW just has a restricted rate option for low bandwidth connections (added when they went from 23 -> 61 Hz).

vvanders 9y ago
So that might be the case for LAN games, generally internet tends to stay lower. Valve for instance recommends 13Hz[1] for Source(CSGO): > // 60 for updaterate is LAN ONLY use 13 for internet > // 20 is default but will cut the maxplayers you can handle in 1/2 > // for SRCDS Servers use 30 - you might be able to use 20 > // sv_maxupdaterate 60 > sv_maxupdaterate 13 Like I said, depending on how good your potential-vis code is you may be able to go higher but you risk saturating your client links and most game netcode doesn't handle congestion nicely. My info is a little out of date(2-3 years) but back then we had to keep data rates below 20kb/sec(and ideally 10kb/sec) if you wanted low jitter across the link. [1] https://support.steampowered.com/kb_article.php?ref=5386-HMJI-5162 https://support.steampowered.com/kb_article.php?ref=5386-HMJ...
- learc83 9y ago
  >So that might be the case for LAN games Overwatch has a 63Hz tick rate over the internet.
  - vvanders 9y ago
    And they handle congestion cleanly[1] which is one of the things I predicated you need if you didn't do 10-13Hz(along with smarter vis sets). Every game is going to be unique and gameplay structure has a huge impact on your data rate. We had games back in '97 like Subspace[1] that handled hundreds of players in the days of dial-up and 200ms+ pings. Generally if your data rate per-link goes above 10kb/sec you'll start to see degradation of jitter across your userbase. There's smart ways to handle that but if you want to do a fixed-tick you run up against that limit really quickly. [edit] Other games will do smart things to keep skill high and tick rates low. CS(but not CS:Go that I know of) used to famously rewind time based on your latency so your view of the world was accurate, but lead to fun behaviors like rubberbanding as you got shot around a corner(due to movement speed slowing down at that past point in time and the game having to reconcile it with the current timestamp). [1] http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2016-08-12-looks-like-blizzard-silently-improved-overwatch-server-tick-rate http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2016-08-12-looks-like-bliz... [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SubSpace_(video_game) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SubSpace_(video_game)
    - bcassedy 9y ago
      Man Subspace/Continuum was such a great game. I do recall issues with packet loss, but in general the game functioned really well even on my 33.6kbps modem with hundreds of players and pretty frenetic gameplay. It's not until you mentioned it that I realize how amazing that feat is.
      - vvanders 9y ago
        Oh yeah, I love to hold up Subspace as a perfect example of why games is so cross-discipline driven. For networked games building design about predicting where someone will be means that frame-to-frame latency almost doesn't matter. The Newtonian physics of that game plays into it perfectly leading to a something that works over primitive modems. Even FPS games to a large degree are about predicting/leading the positions of the other players. Compare that to say, fighting games which are very reactionary and very hard to run over any latent connection without some seriously complicated netcode involving time rewinding.

gsich 9y ago

Only PUBG and Fortnite have such shitty tickrates.